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#1678 - 03/09/05 11:40 PM How credible is this Forum?
Maqhamehlezi Offline
Nduna
****

Registered: 08/05/03
Posts: 362
Loc: Emzini wezi-Nkonjane
Isnt it suppression of other forum members' views a breed of chasing away people with valuable thoughts and contributions in this forum as evidenced by some members no longer willing to take part in the discussions or leaving?How credible are we when we look down upon each other at the same time presenting ourselves as fighting to uplift our own people?Lets remind ourselves that this is a forum and a forum is a MEDIUM FOR AN EXCHANGE OF VIEWS,not a SECT because, if Inkundla becomes or is a sect of few individuals whose so called contributions are more valued than others even if not then where will its credibility be?unless of course this is an organisation that has set beliefs and idealogies that are meant to be instilled in people's minds in the hope of converting them, then if that be the case it automatically seizes to be a medium for an exchange of views and freedom of respectable expression.Umbuzo njalo HOW CREDIBLE IS INKUNDLA?this soul searching question comes after observations into majority of heated exchanges, full of hate,ukweyisana and anger in various topics amongst oppossing opponents in discussion which has resulted in Sibalukhulu intervening on many instances by removing lots of embarrasing postings by some members--Kambe yisintu leso esithi sifuna ukusenza kumbe siyafeketha nje?

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#1679 - 03/10/05 12:48 AM Re: How credible is this Forum?
Sgero Offline
Ndunankulu

Registered: 05/31/04
Posts: 643
Loc: United Kingdom
Mfowethu

INkundla is a forum ele credibility enkulu kakhulu ngokubona kwami okungabe kufiphele.

All games and sports kulemikhuba yakhona eminye kube lo nompembe okhangele ukuba leyo mkhuba iyalandelwa. Ikhaya elihle lilemithetho elandelwayo and if umntwana ngabe uyaphambanisa ephule eminye yemithetho ebekwe ekhaya, uyajeziswa. Kungakho lapha kuNkundla kulemithetho ebekiweyo and kulabantu abakhangele ukuthi imithetho leyo iyalandelwa yiloba ngubani ofaka umbono wakhe ku main forum kumbe ku chatroom. Lokho okufakwe kwangalandeli izenhlelo ezibekiweyo kuyasuswa. Ngale ngaku chat nxa umuntu eletha ukuxokozela uyakhahlelwa ngo size 12.

I forum le is not a personal arena lapho okungeniswa i witch-hunt. Abantu bayaphikisana kujikelwe amazwi alukhunyana kuxolelwane, simply because this is a reflection of a wider society (to an extent). As it happens in any debate, there will be heated words exchanged. Ngingazi ngoba mina ngingumafikizolo, kodwa angikezwa kuthiwa kulabantu who are preferred ukuthi ezabo inkulumo ziziwe. It cannot be controlled how abantu take i debate. Abanye bayaqinisa amakhanda abanye bakubona kungcono bahlehle and come back later. The moderators abalapha are human beings and kulendaba and ideologies that they subscribe to kodwa they make it a point ukuthi they let ama debates flow freely and cleanly loba bengahambisani lama views wonke.

This forum has made it possible for a lot of people to voice their feelings ngezinto ezinengi ezakhayo and I can confidently say that this forum has taught me izinto ezinengi.

This forum has made a lot of us realise ubuntu bethu and made us proud of ubuyithi bethu.

This forum has made it possible for some of us to make friends and associations.

This credible forum has given rise to a conscious awakening of the need for all of us to get together and fight a common enemy with one voice eka Mthwakazi.

This forum has revived the wonderful memories zokukhula kwethu sisima engotsheni sichaya ingubo ezilomchemo, si phoxana, kuseluswa, kunathwa emashabhini.

This forum has made some to become better cooks, better suitors and better business people

This forum has made us laugh on a daily basis from the daily dosage of jokes and look forward to come home after a long day singekho especially esisemazweni who have no other people esikhuluma labo ulwimi lwethu readily.

This forum has made a lot of us appreciate ukulotshwa kwesiNdebele and how to argue a point

This forum has given labo labo abayibona as not credible the platform to witch-hunt and air imbono yabo.

Ngingabalisa lizeliphume ngama reasons why there is much credibility ngale i forum, but i synopsis yikuthi this is a democratic forum and no few misguided persons will derail us from the noble cause of ukuxoxa singabakithi ngolimi olwakithi sixoxa ngezinto ezakha umuzi wakithi.

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#1680 - 03/10/05 01:30 AM Re: How credible is this Forum?
Mabila Offline
Nkosi
***

Registered: 05/14/04
Posts: 2124
Loc: Ayowa
The credibility of this forum is a collective responsibility. All of us have a responsibility of chipping off or adding to credibility through the quality of the contributions that we make. Ubuntu le dignity ye forum ngobethu sonke! Asakheni sibone! Kuyakhilikithelwa kuvukwa njalo.

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#1681 - 03/10/05 12:12 PM Re: How credible is this Forum?
Mabhidliza Tsunami Gagasi Offline
Sikhulu

Registered: 01/20/04
Posts: 286
Loc: Next Door
Maqhama,

Mfowethu uzalombuzo omkhulu kakhulu, but such questions are best answered by the likes of Iraq information Minister or the likes of Berverly Hughes hk hk hk!.
You ask, "Is this forumn Credible?"
My understanding of something credible is something which is Capable of being credited or believed, worthy of belief, entitled to confidence or trustworthy.

Does this forumn have the credibility of representing Mthwakazi values? NO!, It lacks the stamina of possesing the quality of being believable or trustworthy.
One important thing is that it will be a biggest fantassy to assume that because every one interacts in the same language therefore we are one big Happy family so, Mr so and Mrs so, can then try to be Mum and Dad of the forumn.
Credibility does not only come from people being friends in the forumns, but it comes when simple minds start learning to see and agree with the truth when they hear it.

I will urge the owners and the members of this forumn to work real hard if Maqhama's questions are to be answered with a big YES.
Credibility will not come by some characters behaving like circus clowns or bigger than Sibalukhulus, this will only live Sibalukhulu playing host to one or two members of this Inkundla Forumn logging in with several different names just to appear as if there are many members logging in, and that will be the biggest disgrace on this forumn that was once graced by the likes of Great Mtshede, my brother Marcus and the imfamous Honourable Jazi'lindizayo .

Maqhama on the subject of the ethical conduct of this forumn, I wouldn't know ndoda cause recently I failed logging into Inkundla site from my local library, the only answer they gave me was that the council does not promote sites that promote Internet Bigotry , extremism and Racism???? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" /> I was appalled by their answer but that was the truth.

There has been a lot of positives from this forumn though, but the negatives are more reflective and that is the BIG issue.

-------------------------------------------------

Wisdom is knowing what to do next,
skill is knowing how to do it, and virtue is doing it.

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#1682 - 03/10/05 04:18 PM Re: How credible is this Forum?
ntombankala Offline
Sikhulu

Registered: 11/06/02
Posts: 205
Loc: Zimbabwe
Maqhamehlezi - I think that you are bringing in an important observation. How credible are inkundla members? Do they have integrity? Can they be relied upon in any situation? This is how I would want to paraphrase your question. Le yinsindabaphenduli. Hmmmmm - maybe for the time being I will go along Mabhidliza that we do not have "what it takes as yet". Integrity is there - how much? 45 - 50%. That is a good starting point for me. I tried to put myself in your shoes to understand what you wanted to put across. I felt that maybe you wanted to know whether inkundla has "what it takes" to propel Matland to the desired state. In other words, do inkundla members have the balls to go to the wire? Are they hungry for a "fight"?? largely I will say NO. NO. At the moment we dont.If I put words in your mouth - MAYUYU.

Look! good ideas have emerged and we cannot be blind to that except maybe that the majority of those remain fossilised in our site. There is a need to synthesise these to form concrete strategies.It appears kasisukumeli phezulu. This could explain our lack of leadership qualities.

But we can achieve that. Some measure of credibility is there as S'gero shows. But it is not enough. We may want to build on that credibility. Inkundla members love talking. How do we turn that into a STERNGTH and ACTION? We have people with different capabilities and skills. How do we turn that into balls?

We are petrified since there is NO COORDINATING mechanism. At the end of a heated debate people recochet back to their "wait and watch positions" and they will always come back and repeat the same thing and say, "uzibani uyilokhu lalokhu period. With that, you dont go far. What we need is a Jonathan Moyo that gets things done.
Still, Maqhamehlezi, you may assist us in building credibility with some suggestions. All of us need it.

Mabila is correct by saying that credibility is a collective responsibility, we have failed to work towards integrity as a major goal. Perhaps we need to set benchamrks on how this would be attained. The geographical spread of the contributors "seems" to work against this.

In my view we been inconsistent in discussing issues and as such have failed able and capable individuals. Diversity is fine but there is need for guidance. Consider a situation where people are locked in a Jonathan Moyo debate and then someone brings in a topic on "Champions league". ibhora le Europe sibili! Soccer of all things?

If we talk about iBOSSO, let that happen within the context of Matland's big picture. Older posts of inkundla reflect higher levels of integrity.I am shocked that Mabhidliza is moarning - like me - the "departure" of such contributors like Marcus, Ndukuzibomvu, S'mayedwa and many more. They log in and go and keep quiet. Those who have talked with them, do not doubt their integrity.

I do not doubt the integrity of some contributors here. Its just excellent.

We need to be principled, focussed and goal - oriented if we are to earn any credibility. And Mabhidliza - bigotry is the last thing we should be promoting here and one major mistake that comes up intentionally or unintended is the way we lambast all shonas. Let us not forget that other Matlanders are married to shonas and we will alleniate these people. If we want to maintain ubundebele bethu, it should be done in a way that is devoid of uncontrolled and unjustifiable hatred.

I know that I have been part to this but we wont go far with that approach. I am not apologetic about it but I'm one individual who believes in integrity and diplomacy and the use of induku. But I believe in the proper use of induku but not in the careless prescription and manner as advocated for under "isikhathi senduku sesifikile". All our strategies will be still - born if we have so much bigotry around us. Bigotry! bigotry! is a tool of a narrow minded person like Mgobovich and we cant afford to be like him.

I am very much persuaded that we need to be very accomodative much as we may want to carry out pre - emptive strikes. We need to focus on ISSUES and NOT PERSONALITIES. We have assassinated a lot of characters that may have been innocent. Regrettably these things happen when people of different persuassions meet emthonjeni.

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#1683 - 03/10/05 04:20 PM Re: How credible is this Forum?
ntombankala Offline
Sikhulu

Registered: 11/06/02
Posts: 205
Loc: Zimbabwe
Maqhamehlezi - I think that you are bringing in an important observation. How credible are inkundla members? Do they have integrity? Can they be relied upon in any situation? This is how I would want to paraphrase your question. Le yinsindabaphenduli. Hmmmmm - maybe for the time being I will go along Mabhidliza that we do not have "what it takes as yet". Integrity is there - how much? 45 - 50%. That is a good starting point for me. I tried to put myself in your shoes to understand what you wanted to put across. I felt that maybe you wanted to know whether inkundla has "what it takes" to propel Matland to the desired state. In other words, do inkundla members have the balls to go to the wire? Are they hungry for a "fight"?? largely I will say NO. NO. At the moment we dont.If I put words in your mouth - MAYUYU.

Look! good ideas have emerged and we cannot be blind to that except maybe that the majority of those remain fossilised in our site. There is a need to synthesise these to form concrete strategies.It appears kasisukumeli phezulu. This could explain our lack of leadership qualities.

But we can achieve that. Some measure of credibility is there as S'gero shows. But it is not enough. We may want to build on that credibility. Inkundla members love talking. How do we turn that into a STERNGTH and ACTION? We have people with different capabilities and skills. How do we turn that into balls?

We are petrified since there is NO COORDINATING mechanism. At the end of a heated debate people recochet back to their "wait and watch positions" and they will always come back and repeat the same thing and say, "uzibani uyilokhu lalokhu period. With that, you dont go far. What we need is a Jonathan Moyo that gets things done.
Still, Maqhamehlezi, you may assist us in building credibility with some suggestions. All of us need it.

Mabila is correct by saying that credibility is a collective responsibility, we have failed to work towards integrity as a major goal. Perhaps we need to set benchamrks on how this would be attained. The geographical spread of the contributors "seems" to work against this.

In my view we been inconsistent in discussing issues and as such have failed able and capable individuals. Diversity is fine but there is need for guidance. Consider a situation where people are locked in a Jonathan Moyo debate and then someone brings in a topic on "Champions league". ibhora le Europe sibili! Soccer of all things?

If we talk about iBOSSO, let that happen within the context of Matland's big picture. Older posts of inkundla reflect higher levels of integrity.I am shocked that Mabhidliza is moarning - like me - the "departure" of such contributors like Marcus, Ndukuzibomvu, S'mayedwa and many more. They log in and go and keep quiet. Those who have talked with them, do not doubt their integrity.

I do not doubt the integrity of some contributors here. Its just excellent.

We need to be principled, focussed and goal - oriented if we are to earn any credibility. And Mabhidliza - bigotry is the last thing we should be promoting here and one major mistake that comes up intentionally or unintended is the way we lambast all shonas. Let us not forget that other Matlanders are married to shonas and we will alleniate these people. If we want to maintain ubundebele bethu, it should be done in a way that is devoid of uncontrolled and unjustifiable hatred.

I know that I have been part to this but we wont go far with that approach. I am not apologetic about it but I'm one individual who believes in integrity and diplomacy and the use of induku. But I believe in the proper use of induku but not in the careless prescription and manner as advocated for under "isikhathi senduku sesifikile". All our strategies will be still - born if we have so much bigotry around us. Bigotry! bigotry! is a tool of a narrow minded person like Mgobovich and we cant afford to be like him.

I am very much persuaded that we need to be very accomodative much as we may want to carry out pre - emptive strikes. We need to focus on ISSUES and NOT PERSONALITIES. We have assassinated a lot of characters that may have been innocent. Regrettably these things happen when people of different persuassions meet emthonjeni.

Top
#1684 - 03/10/05 04:48 PM Re: How credible is this Forum?
Siphepheli Offline
Ndunankulu
***

Registered: 05/27/04
Posts: 741
Loc: Khonaph'ya Enkangala
This forum has been ok for a long time until some of us started witch hunts. There are some who like myself seem to subscribe to 'clicque' notions of discourse.

It all began in the chat room where some of us felt left out of certain discussions which we were fully aware were being conducted behind closed curtains as it were. I was personally one of those people who were very much aware from simple deduction and from the grape vine that something was afoot but could not place a finger on whatever it was and who was involved. I could log in to the fully packed Dale but fail to strike up any meaningful discourse with any one as they all seemed to be pre-occupied elsewhere, which from obvious deduction was in private discourse.

This really ate into my curiosity so much that I foolishly embarked on a clicque busting witch hunt, and I guess the result is this paranoia and fear of the unknown that is heavily pervading our once very comfortable zones.

It is disappointing though that the very thing that we have been trying to thwart, i.e. ukweyisana for whatever reason has been the tool that some of us have wielded with such impunity and look at the result. I guess some of us guilty of the said misdemeanours are quite satisfied with the result. We can not blame our gracious host for the demise but be Mthwakazi enough ukuthi sizinuke amakhwapha sihloniphanenini.

Okunye bakithi asikhuleni sekele ukuthatha amadiscussions ethu kule iNkundla on too personal a note ngoba kusenza sikhangeleke njengeziwula. Phezu kwalokho bakithi asiziqhenyeni ngokuba yithi singalahli imikhonto phansi sisibathele njengamagwala nxa singathelekana phezu kwamalahle. There is no prescription for an inferiority complex (nor its opposite for that matter). Do not feel 'babyed', belittled, mothered, fathered nor whatever, just be detached from the personae and am sure you'll all be ok.


Friendships, camaraderie, association, alignment or any other relationships evolving from discourses in the forum are the essence that lends a lot of credibility to any forum. If you find that you cannot be in any relationship or whatever from the precious time you spend in any forum, just do not blame it on the forum nor the credibility of such forum, but on your obnoxious self, for that is what you are, for failing to relate to those who you have discourses with. Kanti khona nxa abanye bengafuni ukuba ngabangane lawe sokulicala na? Sokumele behluleke ukuba ngabangane labanye ngenxa yokuthi wena bakwalile? Khona kanti ungathi ufika ebantwini ubone bethula kumbe bechithekana akumelanga uzinuke wena amakhwapha kuqala ungakaqali ukuhumana ngezizatho ezibangele lezo zehlakalo?

I find it very disconcerting that if any one chooses to leave, their departure is blamed on those remaining. Isintu sithi okhalalayo kakhalelwa bakithi. Inengi elasukayo lapha lilakho ukuphenduka njalo so ukuthi sihlale sibhedunulana lenqweqwe zezilonda esezipholile akusizi. Empini kuvele kuyatholakala ukuthi amanye amaqhawe kawafiki ku battle ground for various reasons. And of those that survive the engagement some do not make it back home. Kungakho impi sokumele iyekelwe na ngenxa yokuthi kulabanye abangasekhoyo? Mina ngithi cha!!!!! asiqhubekeleni phambili Mthwakazi omuhle, kodwa sizinuke amakhwapha njalo sihloniphane.

Ayihlome bakwethu!

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#1685 - 03/10/05 05:59 PM Re: How credible is this Forum?
Maqhamehlezi Offline
Nduna
****

Registered: 08/05/03
Posts: 362
Loc: Emzini wezi-Nkonjane
Bakwethu
Mmm!..interesting thoughts laid down by all.This questions is not about the owners of the site as to me they are giving each and everyone of us a platform to engage in things that bother us and want to build as uMthwakazi BUT it becomes sad when certain individuals, it could be me it could you, take it upon themselves to be Inkundla custodians and ontandokayiphikiswa when they are just members like everyone.
This question about how credible is this forum?is not to discredit Inkundla but to let it soul search itself whether, is it breeding what it first aimed to do in its initiation or has it bred some people who think they are the only ones who know what other thosands of people want as in their way of living and handling problems facing them as uMthwakazi.
If the truth be told there some of us here who never concede that they were wrong in some issues even if its quite clear they are and such people will always side with people they have deemed friends even if that friend of theirs is out of touch with a Topic.WE DONT need such pathfinders or Leaders ku Mthwakazi who will just back someone because its their friend or relative when we are dealing with lives of Mthwakazi people,we need men and women who will stand for whats right,practical and worthy of the nation NOT selfish FRIENDSHIP alliances wether found on the forum or outside.If anyone doesnt see the attitude in the forum a cause for concern then its time for that individual to search who they are,why they are what they are?as we search ourselves to the solutions of our existence and identity as a people.
A community thats aiming to grow feels much secure when it loses bad apples in it rather losing a large number of great thinkers,contributors and enforcers wether be its a war or not.Just like you can manage to live when your spinal cord is damaged but you will be like a Vegetable and not independant.What I am saying people in this forum who have great ideas and practical ways of things are like our nation's backbone,so if they are chased away by groupies who think they know all,then our nation will be like a paralysed spinal cord thus our discussions here will always stay stagnant with no progression or action as there always will be people coming in and leaving cause some people are frustrating action, otherwise we will wake up someday an ACTION being done outside this forum whereas it could have erupted from here.Food for thought its time we build each other,when your friend is wrong ungambambathi,tell him or her that they are wrong then your friend will be grateful more coz they will know that you have no partiality but frankness when it comes to truth.Nxa umngane wakho elenqofula uyazithulela ungamtsheli alifinye kumbe uyamtshela,personal I would chose to do the later and I know my friend would thank me in the end.

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#1686 - 03/10/05 06:20 PM Re: How credible is this Forum?
Sibambamahawu Offline
Ndunankulu
***

Registered: 05/04/04
Posts: 803
Loc: KwaGodlwayo
There are many reasons that may cause people to leave permanently or temporarily, reasons not connected or associated with the credebilitry or lack of it of Inkundla. It is interesting to note that this is not a unique feature to Inkundla but all organisations throughout the world, how many people left ZAPU, ANC, churches and other organsiations be they profit-making or non profit making organisations? This has got nothing to do with credibilty or lack of it, st different times in life peopple have different things to do. As for an open forum like this one what matters most is what people contributed, today if i want to read what Jazi wrote some way back i can do that and use his ideas, what matters most is the quality of ideas that people contribute in this forum, for example there are timeless classics contributed by Muntongenakudla on this forum, we can still use his ideas in his abscence.

Having said that, i am not trying to digress nor to run away from the question posed by our fellow forum member (Maqhamehlezi), what i was trying to highlight is that there might be other reasons why people leave, but also interesting to note is that new members are still joining the forum, what does that tell us? i assume that the reasons that lead my brother to join are not much different from theirs. Noone will join a forum without first assessing it. Credibility is not an inborn quality, it is earned, of which i believe that this site has earned a considerable amount of credibility. There are some forum members who consciously or unconsciously drag this site down, through attacking other members on a personal basis, this disease is rife and increasing. Instead of concentrating on issues objectively we sometimes tend to attack each other. The other thing is that people are shutting their minds to other people's views only just because that person once had different views from theirs, and therefore they become pyschologically conditioned to oppose even if it is not necessary or or in actual fact the idea that themselves might have raised. The need to break these man made boundaries has never been so important both in private and public.

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#1687 - 03/10/05 06:42 PM Re: How credible is this Forum?
Siphepheli Offline
Ndunankulu
***

Registered: 05/27/04
Posts: 741
Loc: Khonaph'ya Enkangala
True indeed, but on the other hand do we use diplomacy in correcting the errant person or do we bash him/her down? Take note I shied from using the word friend because it is my belief that anybody can be wrong and we do not need to be his/her friend to correct him/her ikakhulu kithina aboMthwakazi esibhekane lokufelwa yisizwe. Mina ngingomunye walabo abanengekayo ngokubona ukusekelana okugxile ebunganeni okungakhiyo. I am on record for refusing to support anyone just for the sake of being related one way or another. Nxa kuyinto ebulalayo liyafa lonke livumelana ubunke.

I also believe that nxa ungazwisisi kumbe ungasuthiseki ngendlela obona kumbe ozwa ngayo izenzo kumbe inkulumo yomunye umuntu, ungalindeli ukuthi litshone liphume, dinga incazelo khonapho khonapho ukwenzela ukuthi nxa bekulempambaniseko kuhle kulungiseke masinyane kungakaze kutatululane lodaka kumbe kungezelelwe itswayi. Njalo buza mina hatshi omunye ngoba awuzukuthola incazelo eyakhayo komunye ongesimina.

Iziqoqodo zivele zazikhona lakudala njengalamhla. Njalo on a philosophical note, ukuze ngikubone ubuqoqodo yikuthi lami nginamathele kowami umbono njengomkhaza i.e. for anyone to call anyone stubborn it has to be because they are also stubbornly stuck to their guns. I personally do not see anything wrong in that. Phela lakho ukuthi kungavunguza okungumoyana lawe usuphetshuliwe pho mhla kofika inkunzi yesavunguzane kosalani na?

Okunye okumele sikunanzelele njengesizwe yikuthi kulokucabanga lokucabangelana. Of these two one is an evil pastime. Ukucabangelana. If we were all to divest ourselves of this evil, uzathola sesizwanana kule inkundla lemhlabeni jikelele. Ungangicabangeli, nxa ungangizwanga kahle dinga incazelo. Ukucabanga on the other hand should be encouraged ukuze sithole intuthuko. And that thinking should not be the bland type but the critical form (please do not literally take this to mean criticising for the sake of it).

Ngogcizelela njalo ngithi nxa esimbona njengeqhawe ekhalala, efulathela ngokunengwa langokwenyanya, kosisiza ngani ukuthi sikhale zome ngaye? Kambe inkunzi ingafa (literally or figuratively) sekumele sithene wonke amathole lamajongosi asele esibayeni sikhale zome sihlezi embelweni sikhalela le efileyo? Angingathi sihle sikhethe enye phakathi kwalawomathole aseleyo siqhubekele phambili sikhulisa umhlambi.

Mina iqhawe kimi ngumuntu ozimiseleyo ukuthi ebuhleni lebubini, ekulweni lekuthuleni, ekuxoxisaneni ngesineke lekuthukaneni, ekuzwananeni lokungazwanwanwa khona, lelo qhawe lami ulithola litshengisa ukuzwisisa ukuthi asifani sonke, ulithole lelo qhawe lami litshengisela isineke, ukubekezela, uthando lesifiso sokwakha. Labo abakhalalayo abalalo ilungelo lokubizwa amaqhawe ngoba abazimisele ukwakha lokwakhana labanye abantu ababumba lesisizwe sikaMthwakazi.

Ayihlome bakwethu!

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