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#35661 - 01/08/08 06:11 PM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: butholezwe]
Madlenya Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 01/19/05
Posts: 195
Loc: KwelikaMjoji
I am impressed by the openness and honestyness of the discussions here. First before i attempt to respond to Rev Z. Dube's response i would to make a few clarifications, first, i am nota member of the MPC, but i once joined the MPC's youth league, its officials came to my area in Portsmouth and they seemed serious and foresighted, two, i don't know what happened and where they disappeared to.

Mr Dube i would like to thank you for your response, in short your response is honest but lacks depth. It is not inspiring, nor does it give me any sense of urgency in your activities.

Nevertheless, i agree with your assertion when you state that:
Quote:

There has never been a time the people of Mthwakazi have been serious as this. In all fairness let us revisit our trials and tribulations and we will agree that when one finally generate what is exclusively theirs, then they are to be taken seriously.

MPC deserves to be taken seriously, it is the first organisation to talk openly and clearly about the need for an Independent State of Mthwakazi. It has chosen what i call a ultimate struggle for Mthwakazi. It is a struggle the majority of Mthwakazi wish for, but many would like this to be a secret, they want to be considered to be having a national outlook, meaning that they do subscribe to Zimbabwean Shona nationalism, which is pervasive in our society. This is not any easy task for the MPC, to roll back centuries of entrenched Shona system in our midst. People of Mthwakazi are serious, all what they ask for is visible "leadership" and couragious leadership, nothing more and nothing less

You aslo state as follows:
Quote:
Abanye bathi iMPC icathsile, mina ngithi yibo abacatshileyo

This kind of immature response was uncalled for, people are not organisations, people do not seek organisations to join them, but organisations seek people to join them. Organisations must never take people for granted just because they think what they stand for is noble. You will be surprised that if another organisation emerges today which seeks Independence of Mthwakazi it might take all the people including those who are currently your members. An appealing ideology or political stance is not enough on its own to win you membership, but it takes much more than that.

You also go on, revealing your insecurities as follows:
Quote:

If we dismantle MPC, we will have shown lack of maturity and seriousness. Why would someone think we are not serous when they have not shown us an alternative that is serious?

People think you are not serious, i also think you are not serious, your youth came to us only once and disappeared. It does not matter what you think of yourselves but what matters is what people think about you and as it stands, people overwhelmingly think that you are not serious.People need not to show you an alternative in order to express their displeasrue, the MPC has been around for more than four years i think. It took them more than three years to reach me and it has taken so long to reach other people.There is nothing tangible and visible that the MPC has done to show its seriousness, what it has done and has been boldly and indellibly imprinted in people's mind is that it lacks seriousness and leadership.I am being serious abut seriousness.

You also unashamedly shed your organisational responsibility as follows:
Quote:
Akungabi lokufuqela abanye, as MPC we refuse to be hastened by those who are not our members.

If you are not ready to shoulder people's aspirations then maybe you do not deserve to be accorded with the respect you desire. If you feel ukuthi liyafuqela or are being blindly led to the sluaghter house maybe you deserve the quantity and quality of membersip you currently have. Have you ever sopped to ask yourself, why is the MPC not growing? do you think its because people are lazy, coward or do not care about their freedom? Ask yourself, but i will tell you is that people do want their freedom, people do want to get involved, but under the current circumstances, you will not see anyone jining hands with you, Zwangendaba will burn out and leave you as well. Whats wrong with this organisation really? You can't see what is holding it back. You are trying to rationalise the irrational. If you treat people with such a disdain because they are not your members then you have a have a problem. These people you chide today are the future members of thisorganisation, maybe by then you will have given up, kusinwa kudedelwana.

Here you wisely state that:
Quote:
We refuse to be distracted from the path we feel is truly represantative f Mthwakazipeople and not just amaNdebele.

I hundred percnt agree with you on this one, your ideology and political stance is truly represantative of our people we love it and respect it. Never be distracted from it.

In you response i feel that you should have skipped this:
Quote:
But we are pressed with individual obligations to go to work feed our families.

Some things are better not said, they undermine the struggle.


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#35675 - 01/09/08 03:35 PM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Madlenya]
Ncomanzi Offline
Mafikizolo

Registered: 05/16/07
Posts: 8
Loc: Phezulu kwentaba uShamba
Madlenya
Hawu jaha elidala uyintandane ulapho nje?
Iyusi yakhona uthi yavele yakushiya nje esithubeni yathi usulungele ukuzibonela, hhayi yemadoda, bayaphazama laba abantu.Nxa bengena kule inkundla kumele bavuke bazibuthe baqondise izigwegwe, bengatshekisi ngalendlela.
Ngiyathunukala mina nxa ngizwa into izinje.

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#35699 - 01/10/08 05:57 AM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Zwangendaba]
Mthakathi27 Offline
Nduna

Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 323
Loc: Canada

I write what i like and i am not comfortable in my uncomfortability. Let the truth be told. kuhle lokhu zulukandaba, iproblem nge MPC sesiyiqambile, ngibona abantu abanengi bayavumelana ukuthi iproblem yilack of visibility kodwa engibona singakakuqambi yikuthi kungani kulelack of visibility?? Kungabe kubangwa yini lokho? mina as i said i will tell it as it is, if you hate me let it be, this is my contribution to the struggle, hatshi ukuthi angingeke ngijoyine, ngiajoyina when ibandla le MPC liphumela phandle angesabi lutho mina.
the major obstacle to the visibility of iMPC yileader yayo, loyo obizwa ngokuthiwa nguPresident wayo. Let the truth be known and i shall tell it as it is. Unless and until the organisation changes hands there would no progress, this syndrome of privitising the organisation, the struggle and ideology will continue. Let lose and let live. let us all be brave in the heart and tell it to his face, the greatest culprits should be his liutenants for they just blindly follow ad never tell him the truth, now is the time, the time is now to stand up and be counted and never be sheeps.



Quote:
If kungabe abantu besaba ukuyibamba le congress ko [mgabe], akudingwe a friendly country that will allow such a gathering to take place and and work towards helping abantu to get there.
by sgelo

ngivumelana lomr sgelo lapha, uma ethi akubizwe icongress, lapho okuzoxotshwa khona upresident lona kufakwe umuntu ofuna ukusebenza, uzanikezwa laye isikhundla esimfaneleyo kodwa hayi ukukhokhela. uma elesifiso sokukhulula umthwakazi uzaqhubeka ephakathi kwenhlanganiso yeMPC, kodwa uma egijimisa isikhundla kuzabonakala ngesikhathi seCongress lapho ephiwa isikhundla esimfaneleyo ukuthi uzakwenzani.Let the truth be told, for it will liberate us from our fears. If he is man enough he will resign without being forced out, i write what i like and i like what i write. I am never comfortable in my uncomfortability, yes, let the truth be told.
_________________________
Ngingumthakathi wezigodo, umkhunkuli, angibhenyelwa nsangu mina, lizowukhomba olotshwala.

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#35707 - 01/10/08 12:30 PM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Mthakathi27]
Mayihlome Offline
Sakhamuzi

Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 69
Loc: Mhlanga Rocks
Qoki bakwethu,

Liza lazo. Strangely enough, some of us had the priviledge yokuzwa omunye wabasakazi be Shaya FM exoxa labe Matabeleland Freedom Party. These guys also refused to devulge some of the name of their leaders, only two were released. And these are former ZIPRA guys! As far as I know there were no cowards in ZIPRA, so who am I to call these guys cowards?

Akesizibuzeni ukuthi sibenzelani labo abaphumele egcekeni nxa isitha sesiba hlasela.

  • Simenzeleni uPaul Siwela lo George Mkhwananzi mhla bemiswa emthethwandaba besetheswa amacala e"treason"?
  • Simenzeleni u Pius Ncube sebemngenela, bemehlisa laye bemethesa amacala?
  • Simenzelani u Zenzele Ndebele (kumbe njalo sithi thina akazenzele) lapho izinja zikaMgabe sezimhlasele ngenxa yokuveza indaba yokubulawa kwabantu. (Kulabo abangayibalanga yanini lapha http://www.mthwakazian.com/article.asp?aid=1101&iid=162&sud=29 )

Bakwethu singakhohlwa ukuthi isitha silomkhuba omubi wokulanda izihlobo zakho, kulokuthi sikulande wena muntu oqondene lendaba. Mhlawumbe singakayiphambili, let us put ourselves in the so-called President's shoes. Even lalabo abe MPC abathi bavelile, we hardly know their real names.

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#35709 - 01/10/08 05:10 PM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Mthakathi27]
Ngqamngqotsho Offline
Mafikizolo

Registered: 01/09/08
Posts: 5
Loc: Texas
Wena Mdala Mthakathi27 ulwani kanti njalo ukhanya ule inside information ngeMPC le ozoyilwisa lapha! Awufundi ngani ama contributions abanye and respond to them in a reasonable manner?? Namuhla usubhala ngokuthi kuxotshwe umkhokheli, uvele umbangisani lowo Mkhokheli kanti?? Uzobhidliza kuphela wena. Imibhalo yakho nxa ngiyifunda ayisiyo yokwakha, ngeyobuthakathi x 27!!
Very sound reasons have been given on why the leadership could not be ready to be visible, akuphendule sikuzwe ukuthi ucabangani ngakho. Phendula uMayihlome sibone.Ungaphi uBhenaziya Bhutho namuhla?? Yindaba likhuluma angani aliveli elizweni lenja kanje??? Akusitshele nge security ekhona ku MPC oyaziyo wena sazi sasempumalanga??


Originally Posted By: Mthakathi27

I write what i like and i am not comfortable in my uncomfortability. Let the truth be told. kuhle lokhu zulukandaba, iproblem nge MPC sesiyiqambile, ngibona abantu abanengi bayavumelana ukuthi iproblem yilack of visibility kodwa engibona singakakuqambi yikuthi kungani kulelack of visibility?? Kungabe kubangwa yini lokho? mina as i said i will tell it as it is, if you hate me let it be, this is my contribution to the struggle, hatshi ukuthi angingeke ngijoyine, ngiajoyina when ibandla le MPC liphumela phandle angesabi lutho mina.
the major obstacle to the visibility of iMPC yileader yayo, loyo obizwa ngokuthiwa nguPresident wayo. Let the truth be known and i shall tell it as it is. Unless and until the organisation changes hands there would no progress, this syndrome of privitising the organisation, the struggle and ideology will continue. Let lose and let live. let us all be brave in the heart and tell it to his face, the greatest culprits should be his liutenants for they just blindly follow ad never tell him the truth, now is the time, the time is now to stand up and be counted and never be sheeps.



Quote:
If kungabe abantu besaba ukuyibamba le congress ko [mgabe], akudingwe a friendly country that will allow such a gathering to take place and and work towards helping abantu to get there.
by sgelo

ngivumelana lomr sgelo lapha, uma ethi akubizwe icongress, lapho okuzoxotshwa khona upresident lona kufakwe umuntu ofuna ukusebenza, uzanikezwa laye isikhundla esimfaneleyo kodwa hayi ukukhokhela. uma elesifiso sokukhulula umthwakazi uzaqhubeka ephakathi kwenhlanganiso yeMPC, kodwa uma egijimisa isikhundla kuzabonakala ngesikhathi seCongress lapho ephiwa isikhundla esimfaneleyo ukuthi uzakwenzani.Let the truth be told, for it will liberate us from our fears. If he is man enough he will resign without being forced out, i write what i like and i like what i write. I am never comfortable in my uncomfortability, yes, let the truth be told.
_________________________
Kibo kagwala akula sililo

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#35718 - 01/11/08 05:00 AM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Ngqamngqotsho]
Mthakathi27 Offline
Nduna

Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 323
Loc: Canada
Quote:
Wena Mdala Mthakathi27 ulwani kanti njalo ukhanya ule inside information ngeMPC le ozoyilwisa lapha!

okokuqala ngifuna ukutsho ukuthi ngiyayihlonipha imibono yakho, noma nngingavumelani lawe kuyo. Okwesibili ngiyavuma ukuti ngingabe ngisebenzise imizwa ekulobeni ngacina sengilahla umlomo, yikho kukho konke engingabe ngikubhalile okungalunganga ngiyakuwithdrawa.
anngilwi mnumzane ngiyakha, zinengi indlela zokwakha baba, ezinye awungee uziqonde kanti eznye zicacile njal zisobala. what inside iformation are you talking out?, what i have write here kucacile, kusobala njalo akusyo mfomation okungathiwa isensitive kumbe inside infor.ngingabe ngiyitshay' ekhanda na? If so then my analysis is good.

Quote:
Awufundi ngani ama contributions abanye and respond to them in a reasonable manner??

Who defines what reasonable manner is? ngiwafundile amacontributions abanye abantu, ikakhulu ukhala ngeka Mayihlome, it was well written and reasoned. I agree with what he wrote, lathi njengabantu siyabalahla abakhokheli bethu, kodwa ngiphinde ngitsho njalo ngithi, the problem with abaGeorge Mkhwananzi labo Siwela yikuthi bona bebengathi bafuna ifederation but but all of a sudden started preaching violence and secession. They were led by emotions, they did not psychologically condition or prepare the people, hence the lack of visible and tangible support at their hour of need. As for iMPC, kwehlukene kakhulu, iMPC vele siyazi ngekufunayo yikho we can stand shoulder to shoulder with them at their hour of need. abantu bakithi kumele sibathembe, abntu bakithi desire to be free, ungazubona sebekuthemba njengomkhokheli wabo they will never forsake you, but at first you have to earn that trust, but you will never earn their trust if they perceive you as a coward, because they fear that you might desert the struggle and leave them in the wilderness.

Quote:
Namuhla usubhala ngokuthi kuxotshwe umkhokheli, uvele umbangisani lowo Mkhokheli kanti?? Uzobhidliza kuphela wena. Imibhalo yakho nxa ngiyifunda ayisiyo yokwakha, ngeyobuthakathi x 27!!

Yes, i agree with you here, i might have used emotional language therefore i withdraw my statement fully.kodwa iqiniso yikuthi mina ngiyakha, ngingabe ngisebenzisa indlela ongaziqondisisi noma ongazizwisisi, kodwa okusalayo yikuthi inhloso yami imsula njalo unembeza wami uvumela lento engiyenzayo. even ngingafa lamhlanje ngizimisele ukufika ngiyimele into yami phambi kukababa oseZulwini.

Quote:
Very sound reasons have been given on why the leadership could not be ready to be visible, akuphendule sikuzwe ukuthi ucabangani ngakho. Phendula uMayihlome sibone.

When is it going to be ready then? why does it have to be ready in order to come out? the truth is if it does not come out it will never be ready, it will never be refined, politics is not an easy game. ngiyavuma njalo ngiyazi ukuthi kulengozi enkulu ekuphumeni, kodwa kudingakala amadoda alezibindi uma inqola yethu izihamba. ubugwala budangalisa inhliziyo bubuye bukhandle amadolo agcwale lntolo. ngithemba ukuthi ngesikhathi abakhokheli beqala lomzabalazo babekwazi lokhu, njalo babesazi ukuthi kuzamele kuphunywe kungahlalwa kucatshiwe.

Quote:
Ungaphi uBhenaziya Bhutho namuhla?? Yindaba likhuluma angani aliveli elizweni lenja kanje??? Akusitshele nge security ekhona ku MPC oyaziyo wena sazi sasempumalanga??

kambe ngeqiniso ufuna ngiwuphendule lombuzo loba cha? ngoba angazi ezangaphakathi kuMPC. mina ngicabanga ukuthi isecurity lilayo, uma lingelayo kumele ibe khona.
_________________________
Ngingumthakathi wezigodo, umkhunkuli, angibhenyelwa nsangu mina, lizowukhomba olotshwala.

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#35782 - 01/18/08 09:18 PM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Mthakathi27]
Zwangendaba Offline
Nkosi
***

Registered: 04/27/03
Posts: 1399
Loc: New York, New York, USA
Bafowethu.

Silibonge njalo ngokusikhuthaza.

Uma umuntu ekhethiwe ukuthi akhulumele inhlanganiso, akutsho ukuthi loyo muntu ulesibindi ukwedlula abanye abakuleyo nhlanganiso. Loyo muntu usenikelwe ukuthi isive sisile ngaye. WE ALL GO INTO BATTLE KNOWING TOO WELL THAT WE MAY DIE, BUT WE STILL GO INTO BATTLE. IT IS NOT THAT WE ARE BRAVE, IT IS BECAUSE IT IS NECESSARY.

Ngima khonapho zihlobo zami.

Li Zwangendaba.

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#35788 - 01/19/08 04:04 PM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Zwangendaba]
Mthakathi27 Offline
Nduna

Registered: 12/30/07
Posts: 323
Loc: Canada
[quote]
Originally Posted By: Zwangendaba
Bafowethu.

Silibonge njalo ngokusikhuthaza.

Uma umuntu ekhethiwe ukuthi akhulumele inhlanganiso, akutsho ukuthi loyo muntu ulesibindi ukwedlula abanye abakuleyo nhlanganiso. Loyo muntu usenikelwe ukuthi isive sisile ngaye. WE ALL GO INTO BATTLE KNOWING TOO WELL THAT WE MAY DIE, BUT WE STILL GO INTO BATTLE. IT IS NOT THAT WE ARE BRAVE, IT IS BECAUSE IT IS NECESSARY.


Spoken like a true man
Spoken like a true leader
Spoken like a visionary leader
Spoken like a courageos and brave leader
Spoken like a true Mthwakazian
Thank you Zwangendaba

_________________________
Ngingumthakathi wezigodo, umkhunkuli, angibhenyelwa nsangu mina, lizowukhomba olotshwala.

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#35807 - 01/22/08 12:04 PM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Mthakathi27]
Skuvethe Offline
Nduna

Registered: 10/23/03
Posts: 405
Loc: I've never been to Heaven
Protest for Gukurahundi compensation

By Our Correspondent

BULAWAYO, January 22, 2008 (thezimbabwetimes.com) - Activists belonging to a Bulawayo-based pressure group held marches on Sunday in the country?s second largest city, demanding compensation for survivors of the Gukurahundi massacres in Matabeleland and the Midlands .

The Ibhetshu Likazulu activists, who numbered about 100, marched through the streets of Makokoba and Mzilikazi high density suburbs, denouncing President Robert Mugabe for the Gukurahundi atrocities.

The activists carried posters and banners, calling President Mugabe brought to the Hague to be tried for crimes against humanity.

Mugabe stands accused of deploying Five Brigade to Matabeleland and the Midlands in the 1980?s to crush opposition to his rule, resulting in the massacre of civilians estimated at up to 20 000 civilians.

?There should also be a truth and reconciliation commission to heal the wounds of the affected and survivors,? said Qhubekani Dube, Ibhetshu Likazulu spokesperson on Sunday.

?We would not rest. The President should be held accountable for the Gukurahundi atrocities and should be taken to the International Court.?

Ibhetshu Likazulu says the marches are part of this year?s commemoration of the Gukurahundi atrocities. started organizing Gukurahundi commemorations back in 2006.

Just before Christmas, Zanu-PF politburo member, Dumiso Dabengwa, one of Matabeleland?s leading politicians said the Gukurahundi massacres could not simply be washed away.

Touching on a subject that is so sensitive that few dare to discuss it openly, he said people who lost property or were injured during the operation must be compensated by the government.

Dabengwa, a former intelligence officer and top-ranking official of the Zimbabwe People?s Revolutionary Army (ZIPRA), the military wing of PF-Zapu during the war of liberation, was one of the opposition party?s officials arrested and jailed soon after independence. This happened soon after the deployment of the army?s Fife Brigade in the two provinces in 1982. He was released only in 1986.
?For the sake of posterity, let us revisit that era and make the necessary reparations,? he told journalists in Bulawayo on the eve of the celebration of Unity Day.

The Unity Agreement signed between Zanu-PF and PF Zapu in December 1987 brought to an end a period of conflict between the two parties.

Ibhetshu Likazulu last year organised a church service which was presided over by then Archbishop Pius Ncube where victims also gave moving testimonies. Ncube has since been silenced through a cruel sting operation alleged to have been staged by the Central Intelligence Organisation (CIO). He was reported in the media to have been involved in an illicit affair with a member of his congregation.

Former Information Minister, Jonathan Moyo has said he intends to table a Gukurahundi National Memorial Bill in parliament- a memorial for those killed, and the establishment of a fund to compensate those affected by the operation. Moyo a right-hand man of Mugabe for five years, made the startling revelation in 2005 that his own father was killed by Five Brigade in the eighties.

While describing the massacres by Five Brigade as a moment of madness Mugabe has refused to accept responsibility or offer apologies or compensation to victims.

Ibhetshu Likazulu has had run-ins with the police on numerous occasions. About 50 members of the group were arrested last year after they led protests in Bulawayo against a hike in television and radio license by the state broadcaster.

Recently Zenzele Ndebele, the producer of a documentary on the Gukurahundi atrocities said he was forced to go into hiding by suspected state agents following the release of the documentary.

Called ?Gukurahundi: A Moment of Madness? the documentary was launched in South Africa last November.
_________________________
Impi iyoz'ilwe nini? Yithi umgoqo ovimb'esangweni!

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#35808 - 01/22/08 12:38 PM Re: MPC PRESIDENCY: [Re: Skuvethe]
SINATHAMAHEWU Offline
Ndunankulu

Registered: 02/27/02
Posts: 632
Loc: The Republic of Mthwakazi
Great stuff.

Last week I received, through my connections, a GUKURAHUNDI CD album due to be released soon.

A tough CD telling it like it is.


Ayingek' iphele!
_________________________
The average man is a conformist, accepting miseries and disasters with the stoicism of a cow standing in the rain. ~Colin Wilson

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