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#40646 - 10/18/08 05:05 PM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: mpumelelo101]
Madlenya Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 01/19/05
Posts: 195
Loc: KwelikaMjoji
Yazi uthi uyisilima somuntu, awusazi isiZulu, yikho uphamazela, uyanhlanhlatha ugcwala indawo yonke. awazilutho uyisithulu nje. Igama elithi bona, liqale nini ukufana negama elithi bheka? ukubona yikubona esiZulwini naseSiNdebeleni, umama ngumama esiZulwini naseSiNdebeleni. Vuka wena sinoko.

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#40652 - 10/18/08 10:39 PM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: Madlenya]
JJMATSHETSHE Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 127
Loc: LONDON

Quote:
inyembezi=izinyembezi
inkomo=izinkomo
inqagala=iqakala
bheka=bona
ukhulu=umkhulu
umama=u..ma



HAA ! LIYANGIMANGALISA, sifundo bani lesi?
_________________________
There is no Darkness but Ignorance! Siku Information Age Mthwakazi.

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#40656 - 10/19/08 03:48 AM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: mpumelelo101]
JJMATSHETSHE Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 127
Loc: LONDON

Quote:
inyembezi=izinyembezi
inkomo=izinkomo
inqagala=iqakala
bheka=bona
ukhulu=umkhulu
umama=u..ma



Mpume


Kuyala ukuthi ngithule ngale infundiso yakho yesiZulu . Initiallly I considered it a trivial issue kodwa iSintu ngiyasithanda and I am not apologetic about it. Mina ngizakuthi kuwe angisazi isiZulu kodwa nga fundiswa uHlelo lwesiZulu ngu Titsha Ndlovu 'u Ngwaqa' olwesiNdebele lungakaze lubekhona ngama'80 up to 'O' koBulawayo. Kulelo Hlelo(try to get a copy),uzamangala ukuthi leyonto oyibhalayo iyafana nta leSiNdebeleni ngoba iNyembezi/Zinyembezi, isingular ayidingeki njalo inkomo zami le zinkomo zami kuyafana. My advise to you is that khangela/bheka/see/etc iSiNdebele as a dialect of Zulu. For some good reasons that may be geographical or political ,we Mthwakazians have developed it to a stand alone 'language'but ngicabanga ukuthi iSindebele masiqhubeka it 'bottlenecks' and isiZulu takes over, anyway, at least during our days ngoba even iBhayibhili leSiNdebele salithola ngama late 70's. Imagine ukuthi what kind of literature your parents read. I will also go further and say isiNdebele kwesinye isikhathi siyathanda ukunotha ngamasynonyms ngoba siyacupha from other langauges,(naturally so if you know the history). Lesisifundo sakho is a question of style which you can get in iSiNdebele. IsiZulu in SA silama dialects so dont assume that isiZulu you find where you are geographically located yiso sodwa. For example if you go to one part of KZN you will find i porridge called ilambazi and in the other iyambazi and kuyafana lakoMthwakazi. But if you are in the old Transvaal labo Goli uzwa bethi iporridge ngumdoko(probably yisiZulu esicutshwe esiSuthwini ngoba they call it modogo (pronounced) as mutoho).

IsiNdebele is the only langauge kweziphume kwaZulu which was efficiently preserved. There are words which are in everyday usage but ngesiZulu akhombisa ukujiya kolimi. Compare that with iSiswati, Shangani, Ngoni, Si Ndrebele (Southern Ndebele). I zizwe zonke lezi changed their language ukuthi uShaka angazizwa. Zama ukujula ngesiZulu bhudi njalo wethekelele ezigodini ezehlukeneyo.

Quote:
how can you expect pupils to learn zulu novels when they are being taught by non-bonafide zulu speakers??????


Mpume , ayikho nje linto yakho lapha.

You will be surprised ukuthi if you go to Mpumalanga and eGoli that Zulu of yours is taught ngezinye inhlanga . Ngibhala kanje ngilamarelatives(hubby and wife)from ZimTec abakaMthwakazi who are deep down KZN ko Nongoma bafundisa kumaPrimary Schools and their pupils are always the best.Angazi ukuthi wena iSiLungu wasifundiswa ngama bonafides yini. Does it mean ungaya e Melika you will be dysfuntional.

Aku yeke into yakho Mpume.
_________________________
There is no Darkness but Ignorance! Siku Information Age Mthwakazi.

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#40671 - 10/20/08 01:43 PM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: JJMATSHETSHE]
Mbezothuli Offline
Mafikizolo

Registered: 06/12/08
Posts: 40
Loc: Esantini
Xolani bantu. Lababantu bapha lundoda ilanguage of survival eGoli not a lesson in Zulu which are 2 very different things. Sona iSiZulu leSiNdebele kwehlukene mpela especially ipronounciation lamanye amabala awasafani. especially ispoken. Siyezwana nxa sikhuluma but akusafani. Its easy to tell a Ndebele speaker from a Zulu speaker. even lalaba asebahlala eGoli isikhathi bekhuluma this language elithi yiSiZulu its easy to tell.

Into nje abantu beDiaspora dont understand amasurvival tactics eGoli. Sometimes we use them even though its no longer necessary ngoba safica kunjalo. We are trying to fit in. Its painful being an outsider in such a hostile environment. Kusuka kudala obhudi besebenza ewenela lamakhalanga esettla eHillbrow. Kulezinye izindawo where its necessary to learn this Goli funny language. Kodwa isizulu sebesazi ukuthi okungaMaNdebele kuyasazi. So wena hamba emajawundeni uyefunda isiSotho ingabe isitswana then you become less suspect than a 'Zulu' speaker okilizayo. Mina ngingakhuluma laloSisi waKwaZulu engisharer laye iwofisi uyathi 'Ukhuluma njani isiZulu?' Mina besengimqondisa ukuthi 'Cha ngikhuluma iSiNdebele'. lets just say its similar enough to be recognised but not quite the same. 100 years can make a noticeble difference to a language. Especially if you were colonised ngaMaShona!

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#40673 - 10/20/08 02:53 PM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: Mbezothuli]
lvovo Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 02/21/08
Posts: 163
Loc: KZN
Kengibuze lami lapha, is i pronounciation yesiZulu the same na? IsiZulu seNatal leseGoli siyafana? Is i pronounciation yabantu bonke eNatal the same? Mina sengake ngezwa amaZulu phaqa ekhuluma, ngezwa kwehlukene. Ngisakhumbula ebantu behleka ukuthi abanye basebenzisa igama elithi futhi instead of njalo, sengike ngawezwa amaZulu elisebenzisa lelo gama, kangazi ukuthi balithathelaphi, ngoba ngangike ngezwa kuthiwa kalikho esiZuluzwini but now am convinced lelo gama likhona njalo eNatal bayalisebenzisa. Bengicela abangabe befinyelela ukuthola igagasi loKhozi FM, belizame bengafunda okunengi lapha. Lalela inxoxo ezikhona and conclude wedwa ungayengwa muntu.

Yah this guy ubedinga indlela zoku phila eGoli yikho nje mina ngathi, there is no need coz ngesiNdebele sakhe he is more than safe. He can communicate with anyone. Ngingaxwayisa ukuthi engafundela ukuzwa isipedi, tswana, sotho. Ngoba ama pedi esikhathini awathandi ukukhuluma ngesiZulu, bayabe besithi umZulu lo, wena uzishayela isiNdebele sakho. Funda ukulalela lezi ezinye indimi, ukukhuluma isiZulu, ngesiNdebele sakho uyinqwele ndoda.

Kulabo abenza ulimi lukamama esikolo, bayazi ukuthi uhlelo lweseZulu lesiNdebele luyafana nje. esiZulwini impambosi layo ikhona. IsiZulu lesiNdetshu one and the same thing ekwakhiweni kwamagama. LesiZulwini lakho amagama wokwebolekwa kwezinye indimi akhona njalo manengi. Kambe amaZulu ma ebheke icomputer ayibiza ngagama bani? Amagama okweboleka manengi, kumane kufane lasesiNdebeleni, amagama okwebolekwa maningi. Umahluko usekuthini amagama la, abolekwa evela ngaphi. isitulo - ngithemba lesiZulwini likhona leligama lesihlalo ngoba lithathelwe esibhunwini Stool. Skool - isikolo, ibhulugwe, isitubhu - there is a zulu on my stoep. Kuyafana xathu. Thatha ugwalo luka C.T. Msimang oluthi Kusadliwa Ngoludala uzabona ukuthi umahluko awukho..

Ngizacina ngokuphanyeka lintambo ukuze lifunde, beselisitsho umahluko phakathi kwesiNdebele lesiZulu. By the way its straight from isifundazwe sakwaZulu.

http://www.kznworks.gov.za/Portals/0/Doc...AKA_KA_2008.pdf

This abstract is interesting wish i had the paper. Funda uzizwele ukuthi bathini ngezinye iziqu ezisetshenziswa elimini lwesizulu, which might explain some issues raide by Mpumelelo01. ku, kwo, ko these are examples so isiZulu sikanengi, it now depends ukuthi wena utahnda kuphi after all

Language is dynamic and not static it changes to suit isikhathi. Thats why uzwa abantu bekhuluma ngemi dhanso (dance) ngoku klabha (clubbing). Amagama anjengabo iyadlisa meaning iblind they are now accepted, ngithemba ku next Zulu dictionery azabe esekhona, that shows how dynamic i language can be. isiZulu seJozi lesiZulu seNatal angithembi ukuthi kumana kufane xathu I stand to be corrected.
_________________________
Novus Ordo Seclorum

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#40678 - 10/20/08 11:12 PM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: lvovo]
JJMATSHETSHE Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 127
Loc: LONDON
Quote:
the way amandebele speak "umduduzi" will send a zulu(oro a swati) looking for cover!!!!!!!!!!!


Cover, what cover manje?

No sane person will look for cover because somebody speak a langauge with an accent. People are more mature than that and obviously they know better Zulu than to look for cover on the call of u Mdu.They know that Zulu is spoken differently. We all speak languages with an accent including those Zulus when they speak Zulu , Swatis when they speak Zulu and thina amaNdebele when we speak Zulu. 'Same applies to the way we ALL speek English. So?

The accent of any language is determined by a multiple of factors eg, geography ,tribe, class, ,level of education, age, audience etc. Sowatans have their Zulu accent which can also be varigated. Just as Mpumalangans and KZNs. Coloureds speak Afrikaans with a different accent from the Boers and they both speak English with a distinct accent but they teach either of the languages. Who has ever looked for cover. Ngubani ibona fide? Like English and other langauges abanzi ,Zulu is diverse and it is ignorance to contain it in a straight jacket the way Mpume does .For the past 20years Ndebeles have created a huge and strong community in eGoli,isigodlo being Zimbrow such that there is no need to crack your head, because , the shops ,butcheries ,nurseries clubs/bars,hair and beuty saloons, fruits/vegs mkts are run ngesiNdebele. I taal uzoyifunda late sewublome lamajita .Why not take a conceited effort to teach SA your SiNdebele esamacimbi and uxakuxaku ngoba the last time I checked Gautengers only get these things from Limpopo province laseZim and amaSA from the majority of provinces abazazi lezizinto. Alike liyeke ukutshotshobala, speak your language NXA kukhona abangakuzwayo bazobuza libacasisele ande vaysivesa! There is a lot that they can learn from us just as we always from them.
_________________________
There is no Darkness but Ignorance! Siku Information Age Mthwakazi.

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#40683 - 10/21/08 05:27 AM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: JJMATSHETSHE]
lvovo Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 02/21/08
Posts: 163
Loc: KZN
Reference is made to my last posting. There is a paragraph where I wanted you guys to look at the prefix ku, kwi, ko. There is a paper unfortunately angilalo which looks at that prefix. Lokhu ngizama ukutshenisa ukuthi isiZulu siyi one kodwa kwehlukana iziqu zamagama, zisehlukana nje ngezigaba ngezigaba.

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/nisc/ling/2002/00000020/00000004/art00002?crawler=true

I think lezinsuku we use Zulu as a ambrella language, ikantike esiZulwini bekulamantungwa, amaqhwabe, abakoMthethwa etc etc. Bonke laba labo bebengamaZulu so that also has to be taken into consideration. Ngiyabona
_________________________
Novus Ordo Seclorum

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#40720 - 10/25/08 02:16 PM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: lvovo]
Emz Offline
Sakhamuzi

Registered: 02/16/08
Posts: 80
Loc: Diaspora
lapha singakhamana ngemiphimbo kuze kulamule indlala.

into yakuqala, akula ngitsho loyedwa umZulu owazi isiZulu ongasizwayo isiNdebele and vsv.

okwesibili kulemikhakha emithathu egqamile yamaNdebele azithola eseseMzansi and indengeko zokufunda ulwimi lwesiZulu ziyatshiyana

umkhakha wakuqala ngama-diaspora asuka ngencwadi zaseZimbabwe inengi belingena ngokuvumelekile eSouth Africa , no need for any disguise in language.

owesibili ngama-diaspora asuka eMzansi as South Africans basebelamaphepha alungileyo, lingizwe kahle angikhulumi ngendlela abawathola ngayo/ngazo. laba bangasifunda isiZulu ngoba sebengamaZulu ngokwephepha kodwa akudingeki kakhulu.

owesithathu is the rest of us amadabulap' lama-overstays we have to learn isiZulu sikwazi ukukhulumisana nabaninindawo kulula ke nxa usazi isiNdebele lanxa nje ungezwakala lapha lalaphaya. nxa ukulumkhakha njengami funda isiZulu ungayangeki you are not inferior in any way uzama ukuphila.
_________________________
maturity is of the mind, not of age, however, the magnitude of one's experiences is a function of age.

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#40721 - 10/25/08 02:56 PM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: Emz]
JJMATSHETSHE Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 127
Loc: LONDON
Quote:
into yakuqala, akula ngitsho loyedwa umZulu owazi isiZulu ongasizwayo isiNdebele and vsv.


Uyalamula muntu weNkosi uyasinceda. Ngiphinde ngikugcwaliselele ngo kuthi laleyo ndlela okhuluma ngaso leso siZulu (accent and style or preference yoku biza amagama athile eg ukunatha/ukuphuza) if you decide to for survival or conformation reasons ,will be determined by other factors like i geographical location or abantu ovame ukubloma labo/nabo. Kwamanye amaZulu ,ukunatha is acceptable if not an advanced way of articulating oneself kodwa kwabanye amaZulu akaMthwakazi batshetshisa/basheshisa bakuqondise bathi yikuphuza. Minengi imizekeliso/imizekelo. Ma uKwaMashu kumbe eMndeni eSoweto, eMpumalanga kumbe emapulazini aseMgungundlovu you can not stand on the mountain with authority and say yiyo yodwa indlela okukhulunywa ngaso isiZulu. Ibanzi linto .

Sesibanengi kakhulu eSA ikakhulu e Goli. I community kaMthwakazi iqale ukugxila about 20 years ago ibalekela imajinalayzeshini ,i asayilamu yanamahalnje ingakaziwa .Banganani abantwabethu, angithi sesingokhulu. Ngokunjalo asibeni lecebo lathi njengoMthwakazi si inkopharethe the Mthwakazi SiNdebele into the Zulu basket NXA sise South Africa. They are many advantages, to mention but a few ; lawo mafears wokudiphotwa, azotshabalala/shabalala ngoba lawo ama SA azabe esekhuluma okuxubene lokwethu njengamaSuthu ase Lesotho lawaseSoweto, okwesisibili we will be able to advance izinga leSiNdebele ngoba ungathi si under threat koMthwakazi. Implan :invite your typical Zulu for a braii and prepare ipapa ulibize isitshwala.Dont conform yena its his turn to conform kwakho. Malisnekha in between drinks akube lamacimbi ( not amasonja ngoba yisiShangani leso)amoungst your snakes . Eat them with pride and uzokudla laye akholise. Uzamuzwa esetshela abanye ebabaza ubunandi becimbi.
_________________________
There is no Darkness but Ignorance! Siku Information Age Mthwakazi.

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#40723 - 10/25/08 05:01 PM Re: pliz translate this, or else ngiza diphothwa!! [Re: Emz]
JJMATSHETSHE Offline
Ngqwele

Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 127
Loc: LONDON
Mina ngicabanga ukuthi uZulu ngumuntu o iright ma uthe waziphatha kahle. If singabasondeza eduzane sibadlise ama snacks we cimbi, uxakukuxaku, itshomoliya lezinye izintonto esizikhonzileyo kithi, we will be good friends. Labo bafunde okunengi ngempucuko yethu lathi sifunde impucuko yabo including our respective styles of comunication.Singabesabeleli khatshana. Kasibaboniseni ubuhle bethu njengesizwe sikaMzillikazi ,imbeko, imbali yethu, our own politics, lakusasa bazosivikela instead ukuthi basigwaze. Let them view our relationships with them as symbiotic and not parasitic.There are probably more Lesotoans and Swazilanders in SA than in their respective countries but bona kabadipothwa based on langauges.A very big productive and reproductive population of Mthwakazians are in SA and many Mthwakazi families have a child in SA ,if not all of their children.Manje ikusasa yethu iphi masizahlala sengathi singamabhalabhala as if siku rehearsal yempilo kanti siyaphila e SA njalo sigugela khona.

Kwayena uMshina wami ubaba JZ akasimuntu engibona kunzima ukum- befrienda. Asim-befriendeni phela boMthwakazi at an official level! Hiii !Libonanjani!
_________________________
There is no Darkness but Ignorance! Siku Information Age Mthwakazi.

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