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#38636 06/17/08 01:02 PM
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Ngiyabingelela
Sengani lingaqhuba kahle la likhona, ngokuthula langesineke.
Ngakwami iNkosi 'sasigcinile.
Mangibheka amashop next door, kwesokhohlo lakwesokunene ngitholukuthi balengise amabhakani 'business as usual'

Is it not painful how life goes on despite all the injustices and suffering that mankind experiences everyday? One would hope that the sun stands still at noon until all justice is realised and suffering done away with all across humanity. I find this a harsh reality that life does not wait for anyone. Some say life is not fair, others say life is fair to all.

This has however, made me understand the community of isigxingi lesi. To some on this forum, it is business as usual but to Mthwakazi, it should be a matter of life and death.

While it is good and healthy to have a balanced scrutiny of our views, it is also imperative that everytime one is in dialogue to always be conscious of who they are dealing with. The integrity of a Mthwakazian is the upholding of 'isintu' way of living. Looking at the whole ideology one will find that isintu embraces democratic principles of governance. This should not leave us vulnerable but rather should enhance our security. Democracy should not mean that others come and walk all over us, trampling down every little structure we are trying to erect. As we live, as we are, so should those that come and live among us. Not that they should become mimics of us but their diversity should come and enjoin us without destroying our structures. As we welcome people from different backgrounds, such peoples ought to come and add and not subtract from us, they come to enhance that which aspire to build and not to oppose that we want to build. We also welcome along with them new ways of building, new ideas of doing things and we do away with our old ways of doing things, we stop malpractices and embrace new and positive systems of working and living.
Above all abantwana bakaMthwakazi need also to be vigilant and not waste energy on minor issues for example, some are here to socialise and there is nothing wrong with that because their countries are at peace or at least not experiencing what Mthwakazi is experiencing. Most of such people are noticed by their arguments, philosophies, foul language and destructive attitudes. At best they will give you a good, enlightening and challenging debate but our vision is a matter of life end death.

The fault is not with them because they have nothing to worry about. The onus remains on a Mthwakazian to make sure they remain focused on the vision. OUR VISION IS TO REVIVE, MOBILISE AND GATHER OUR PEOPLE TO ONE CAUSE - Mthwakazi freedom. There is nothing philosophical about this and there is nothing to argue about either.

Distraction is our worst enemy on this site. People socialising are achieving their ends at the expense of a Mthwakazian who gets sidetracked into these philosophical debates. TO A MTHWAKAZIAN ITS NOT BUSINESS AS USUAL. To our neighbours on this side and on the other, esixoxisana labo la esigxingini, it is business as usual


HLABA-1-AT A TIME
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Mthwentwe, ngiyakubingelela lapho ukhona sengathi uMvelingqange engakugcina.
Uqinisile uma uthi thina esingebona abakini egcekeni asisoze sabanolwazi lobunzima benu. It would be very difficult for a person who also went through a period of violence and victimisation to state that they know exactly what you as abaThwakazi are going through. Let alone a person who has never feared for their lives or had to flee their home in the middle of the night to sleep in the fields or hills.
The most important point you make is that abaThwakazi are in the driving seat, they musn't allow themselves to lose focus. In the post "Xenophobic Attacks" aftermath I have observed some people on this forum saw an opportunity to throw mud at a certain African nation. Why? I don't know because it is not adding value to anyone. All it is doing is casting a doubtful shadow on the character of abaThwakazi, in my eyes.
I stumbled on this forum while researching Africanism. I must admit that I had no idea that abaThwakazi existed. I only knew of the vague history of iMfecane and that uMzilikazi ended up in the neighbouring country. I had no idea that uMugabe was using your nation as cannon fodder. The reality of your struggle was driven home when I asked a guide from Zim about the Mthwakazi nation. Although I can't remember his exact answer but it was filled with animosity and packed with disdain.
This was the point when I asked "What can the average mzansi citizen do to assist uMthwakazi?" Funnily enough I didn't get the feel that uMthwakazi has thought about the involvement of the mzansi peoples. They seem to be only concentrating on the political leadership of umzansi.
In short, I will keep in mind that as a guest I must be aware of the state of the home I'm a guest at.
Finally what is the preferred involvement by non-Mthwakazians?


iTshel'ncane likaNjinfaya kaMashiyak'khalwa kaNogwaja omhlengemlenze!
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Originally Posted by Skhotha
Mthwentwe, ngiyakubingelela lapho ukhona sengathi uMvelingqange engakugcina.
Uqinisile uma uthi thina esingebona abakini egcekeni asisoze sabanolwazi lobunzima benu. It would be very difficult for a person who also went through a period of violence and victimisation to state that they know exactly what you as abaThwakazi are going through. Let alone a person who has never feared for their lives or had to flee their home in the middle of the night to sleep in the fields or hills.
The most important point you make is that abaThwakazi are in the driving seat, they musn't allow themselves to lose focus. In the post "Xenophobic Attacks" aftermath I have observed some people on this forum saw an opportunity to throw mud at a certain African nation. Why? I don't know because it is not adding value to anyone. All it is doing is casting a doubtful shadow on the character of abaThwakazi, in my eyes.
I stumbled on this forum while researching Africanism. I must admit that I had no idea that abaThwakazi existed. I only knew of the vague history of iMfecane and that uMzilikazi ended up in the neighbouring country. I had no idea that uMugabe was using your nation as cannon fodder. The reality of your struggle was driven home when I asked a guide from Zim about the Mthwakazi nation. Although I can't remember his exact answer but it was filled with animosity and packed with disdain.
This was the point when I asked "What can the average mzansi citizen do to assist uMthwakazi?" Funnily enough I didn't get the feel that uMthwakazi has thought about the involvement of the mzansi peoples. They seem to be only concentrating on the political leadership of umzansi.
In short, I will keep in mind that as a guest I must be aware of the state of the home I'm a guest at.
Finally what is the preferred involvement by non-Mthwakazians?

You are right mnewethu in many ways.

Firstly, involving the ordinary Mzansi, this is needed, but at a more crucial level it is the fault of uMthwakazi, they expect to be known, they cry in silence, it does not work like that, but again uMzansi must ask when you see a name like Gumede from Zimbabwe where does it come from. But they must make their case known with the people, abantu baseKwazulu, base township, people pressure their governments.

Secondly after the Xenophobic attacks, I thought to myself what is wrong, starting to say Zulus are somehow backward with no proof, it smacked of Shona arrogance, if Zimbabweans were so intelligent and educated why are they eating grass, education is far from intelligence, to me a Zulu will always be my brother, I do not care who tries to split us up, I understand why they want to split us up, how are Mthwakazi more intelligent than Zulu's because they come from Zimbabwe, what has a Zimbabwean ever invented that a Zulu has not, just education because there was the opportunity.

But at the end of the day uMthwakazi has to be active, today the MDC there is no Mthwakazi voice, this is a danger or a blessing. Only when Mthwakazi realises its war, then they will argue,go overseas and want to exist like whites whilst the nation tumbles, lina, lingazodlala la. It will mean oMthandazo Dema Ngwenya died for nothing, do not let them die for nothing, it will mean oMasotsha Ndlovu died for nothing, o JZ Moyo died for nothing, the General Lookout Masuku died for nothing, remember JZ moyo why he died, he said siyidengeza we are special mud rich mud we do not mix with the cheap mud of abetshabi, it will mean we did not use the Unity accord to organize properly, it will mean oNorman Zikhali died for nothing, it will mean we did not uphold the warnings of uNduna uNdiweni in high esteem, them Malunga was talking for nothing in parliament, it will mean those like Mangena who wanted total war have been betrayed all because of emotions and wanting the show, to be the star, there is no star, I tell you today only if you realise that if for example you are a Ngwenya even if you have $10 million and another Ngwenya cleans a white mans garden you are not better than him, then you will be a nation. uSkhotha is right, uphold yourself like the giants you are, hold the emotions like true warriors.

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Bafwethu akweningisize lapha ngifuna uMtongenakudla wakwaDlangezwa, ukhona ongangitshela ukuthi ngingamtholaphi? ngingajabula uma ningangitholisa yena. Ngiyabonga.


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Mzwakwethu
Mthwentwe this is a well written article, but i am wary of blaming other people for our short falls or to seek to stiffle debate because of perceived differences or aspirations. I have been on this site for sometime now, i have realised one thing, that those that came across as anti-Mthwakazi are actually pro-Mthwakazi, they were enriching our experiences, showing us that there are many sides to a story and we have to be prepared to defend our cause from whatever angle.
Skhotha i am one of those who accused you of masquarading as a Zulu, now i have to say that i respect your stance, i am still not sure whether you are Ndebele or Zulu, your Zulu is as good as Ndebele. I have to say that as from today i will debate with you as brother and as a Zulu. Your question of what involvement is needed from the Zulu masses or other South African masses i svery important, but for now i think it is essential that we concentrate on making links with your leadership at all levels. Your time for involvement will come, when the crunch time comes we will need everybody's involvement. What we can ask of you and your fellow men is to learn your history, try to understand what our origins mean to us. I can see that you feel deeply offended by the insults directed at Zulus, i understand your feelings but you have to understand the feelings of those who hail those insults. I am sure that those who insult you and your fellow men feel deeply betrayed, they expect Zulus to defend Mthwakazians and Mthwakazians to defend Zulus. If you have been reading what i have been writing here you will know that i have refused to believe that Zulus are the ones behind these xenophobic attacks. Xenophobic is a South African thing, not a Zulu thing. Isicelo sami yikuthi uhlale ulungisele ukuthi ngosuku lapho uphondo lukhala, imbizo ibizwa nawe uze nowakho umkhonto kunye leHawu lakho.


Ngingumthakathi wezigodo, umkhunkuli, angibhenyelwa nsangu mina, lizowukhomba olotshwala.
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I am inspired.


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Nduna
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Ngiyabonga mfo
One thing I love is debate. I navigate this site as far back as possible just to know what others have had to say or contribute. If you also do , Im sure you have noticed how Mthwakazi has delved into all different topics in debating, and that for years. Our people just love community living.
My main point in my previous post was that our people should always remember that some people here engage in debate for cosmestics reasons whereas ours is a matter of life and death. These then make it two different visions, or di-vision. We have a dire situation and I m sure you would appreciate that if everything is normal. It therefore becomes very important to scan what fruit is likely to come out of a particular topic or debating. What I m not in agreement with is vulgar language and unfruitful debating. Besides this, some people have differed with Mthwakazi from day one and check how this site has been around for and WHAT DO YOU SAY TO THAT.
Waal, i I dont know who has blamed who for our own short falls. But I still think its ok for Mtwhakazi to have its own short falls, for who has not got their own. Why should our short falls be special? There is no one who is perfect no matter how polished they may appear before us. We really appreciate those that give us their time and contributions but not those who come here to stiffle our people. This community is real, we could not express ourselvs on the earth although things are getting better by each day. So this place is real, its our society and as such there are the learned, educated, uneducated, rich, poor, shapely, unshapely. EVERY ONE HAS A RIGHT TO VERBALISE , OUR PEOPLE HAVE CONFINED FOR TOO LONG. LET THEM TAKE OFF THEIR STEAM WITHOUT FEAR AS LONG AS THEY REMAIN CIVIL, People dont need facts and evidence of every thing they say. After is it not their own opinions? How can an uneducated person give you references, figures, demorgraphics, epidemiology, mortality rates and note? Those that know what you are talking about will respond in that way but why stiffle those that are not of that level of understanding. You fight that debates should not be stiffled but you are comfortable when fellow beings are being stiffled or I m not understanding you mntwanenkosi?




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Mthwentwe, ninjani kwelakini? Siyaphila thina ngapha kweNyalazi.

Angibuze lapha mfowethu, ushukuthi kulungile umuntu ekhulume into engelona iqiniso egameni lokuthu ngumbono wakhe lowo?


iTshel'ncane likaNjinfaya kaMashiyak'khalwa kaNogwaja omhlengemlenze!
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Nduna
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Skhotha
Ngiyabonga mfo thina siqhuba kahle. Kuyathokozisa ma lani liphilile. Ke ngiphambuke kancane, kungaphi kanti eNyalazi?
Lisibize phela mnakwethu ngekhisimusi, ngike ngiyidlalele kwelakini.
Umbuzo wakho ngingazi ukuthi ukhulumela kukuphi.Ma iyistraight forward question, hatshi mina ngazi amanga emabi ngazo zonke izikhathi. Ma ungumbuzo ogolombayo, better siqale sizwe ukuthi amanga okhuluma ngawo yiwaphi phela mnewethu. Nanko abanye babethi amanga mabi,mahle epholiseni. Until sizwe ukuthi okungasiqinisa yikuphi, I am not qualified to give you a correct answer.


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Ngqwele
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Originally Posted by MTHWENTWEHLABA1
EVERY ONE HAS A RIGHT TO VERBALISE , OUR PEOPLE HAVE CONFINED FOR TOO LONG. LET THEM TAKE OFF THEIR STEAM WITHOUT FEAR AS LONG AS THEY REMAIN CIVIL, People dont need facts and evidence of every thing they say. After is it not their own opinions?

Uphile nje mfowethu Mthwentwe.
Phela iNyalazi ngumfula wangakithi kwelikaShamase. Lihle izwe langakithi kodwa silibulala thina bantu abantsundu bese sikhomba abanye, kodwa indaba yolunye usuku lolo.

Njengomuntu othanda izinto ezihlukanisekayo nginakho uku-over simlpifier or splitting peas. My question is a general one. To say that we should debate in a way that doesn't exclude those who aren't highly educated is correct but when a person decides to state something as fact I think it is only fair to ask them to support that fact.


iTshel'ncane likaNjinfaya kaMashiyak'khalwa kaNogwaja omhlengemlenze!
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