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Joined: Dec 2007
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skotshi Offline OP
Mafikizolo
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Mandebele, for sure iZANU yaliginya. Now Serious country issues are being negotiated and aMandebele are basically on the sidelines. That disturbes me a little bit, does it not diturb you people? What about our interests, our issues, our concerns, does this mean that we are not significant anymore. I am not trying to be a tribalist in any way or form, but I feel we also have to have a representative. Since ZANU and ZAPU merged, are you trying to tell me that uMugabe nguye osimeleyo.

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Hey Monna,
Kokunye kwakube kuhle ukuyeka izinja zixakhelane ngoba ungazama ukuz'xakulula z'jika zikulume wena.

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Ndunankulu
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Who ar ethe people negotiating kuma Talks? There are six negotiators two from each party. MDC both faction have atleast a Ndebele intheir negotiating teams. ZANU as usual is not a Ndebele party there is none from Matebeleland.

Kodwa I guess if we get these guys's profiles the better. There is something interesting about Lovemore Moyo the MDC T negotiator, he is married to S'thembiso Nyoni's daughter, kambe will he negotiate in good faith??


Pope John Msupa

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On what grounds should those representing Mthwakazi interests be parachuted into the talks about talks?
The chickens are now coming home to roost! Amandebele are not on the sidelines. What is on the sidelines are those Ndebeles who clamour for independence from Zimbagwe. You will recall that an article appeared on this august site where it was proposed that Ndebeles had nothing to vote for in the elections of March 29. That article was praised to the heavens in this very web site. Another appeared to denigrate Dumiso Dabengwa and cast aspersions on his manhood by an outfit whose leaders are so manly that they choose to dorn the cloak of anonymity as though life, dear life depends on it. As a result of this myopic line of thinking coupled with the lack of joined up strategic thinking those that purport to have Mthwakazi's interests at heart do not have a mandate from the people of Mthwakazi. It is telling that out of the forty or so parliamentary constituences seats in the whole of Matebeleland, seven had candidates from organisations that claimed to represent Mthwakazi interests. I am of course talking about the FDU and PUMA. For a variety of reasons the performance of these two organisations is best described as dismal.
It is often said that you have to speculate to accumulate- the truth of the matter is that organisations purporting to represent Mthwakazi interests failed and abysmally so to do just that. Rather they "roped" themselves to the sidelines focussing their attention on the trivial and at times on the downright puerile - we were regaled with questions of why is it called Mavambo/Kusile rather than Kusile/Mavambo and other fantastic tales of how Ndebele leaders had "roped" themselves under four Shona leaders.As events now unfold kwaMgodoyi it is abundantly clear that this stance was misguided and bordering on the foolish. As a direct consequence of this monumental indifference and apathy the number of seats held by parties representing Mthwakazi interests is zero, zilch and nil. The parties and their leaders failed to speculate and thus accumulated nothing at all. Yet again Mthwakazi has been caught with pants down. For posterity the MDC in its various stripes went on to win 28 of the forty seats available in the region. The current talks about talks involve all those that are stake holders as a direct consequence of a mandate from the people. Granted some of the mandate derives from gerry-mandering of the electorate. Nonetheless, both MDCs and Zanu-pf have a mandate from the people of Matebeleland and are therefore legitmately representing the people of Matebeleland. To put it bluntly Mthwakazi's interests are not represented as consequence of dismal failure by Mthwakazi leaders to do just that - lead. There has been a derelection of duty bordering on gross negligence. Mthwakazi has made herself a bed of nails and for better or worse which she must now lie in it.

Let this be a salutary lesson to all those that proclaim a wish to see an independent Mthwakazi through jaw jaw rather than war - Mthwakazi must participate, join the throng and jostle for positions with those MDCs and Zanu otherwise that same old song of being sidelined will ring. You cannot haughtily turn your nose at participation and then turn around and cry that you are being excluded!! Simply put, when a pie is being baked, when all and sundry is running around collecting and collating all the ingredients, if you choose NOT to participate in all this you have little or no right to cry foul when you are denied even the crumbs of the pie. If it is to be jaw jaw then engagement and participation are paramount. Mthwakazi must join in and enter the fray - when caps are being thrown in the air she must be seen to be part of the throng, when tears are running down cheeks hers too must be wet, when there is laughter her pearls must ring with that of the others.


Whenever people agree with me I always feel I must be wrong

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Ndunankulu
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Jazelindizayo

Let the truth be told, I think you said it all.

Mthwakazi should participate period.


Pope John Msupa

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Forgive me if I am mistaken but did Tshwankilayi participate in the recent presidential election?

Moreover what has this so called participating brought for the two factions of MDC and others like Makoni? Did they not "participate" in previous talks and the first round of elections? Have their MPs or councillors been sworn in.

Having just read the recent statement from the very consistent Mthwakazi Peoples Convention, I would like to agree that abantu kasifuni kufunda.

If Mthwakazi does not want to legitimise mgabe by taking part in fraudulent elections and sham talks, it is their God given birth right.

Originally Posted by Msupatsila
Jazelindizayo

Let the truth be told, I think you said it all.

Mthwakazi should participate period.

Last edited by Bhudaza; 07/23/08 12:51 PM. Reason: izipele

On your way up, be good to those you meet. You could meet the same people on your way down!
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Originally Posted by Bhudaza
Forgive me if I am mistaken but did Tshwankilayi participate in the recent presidential election?

Moreover what has this so called participating brought for the two factions of MDC and others like Makoni? Did they not "participate" in previous talks and the first round of elections? Have their MPs or councillors been sworn in.

Having just read the recent statement from the very consistent Mthwakazi Peoples Convention, I would like to agree that abantu kasifuni kufunda.

If Mthwakazi does not want to legitimise mgabe by taking part in fraudulent elections and sham tals, it is their god given birth right.

Originally Posted by Msupatsila
Jazelindizayo

Let the truth be told, I think you said it all.

Mthwakazi should participate period.

Having read the statement that you refer to above I must say that I am underwhelmed by both its form and substance or more precisely the lack of it. Earlier on I referred to how at times Mthwakazi leaders can be puerile. This statement epitomises that. How mature is thinking behind the statement that is quoted below, just how much joined up thinking is there behind this:-

Quote
you can not form a government in a non-existent State.

So according to MPC, Zimbabwe is non-existent state and I guess that is news to everyone not least the UN and every other major country in the world. Not so long ago the MPC claimed that they will negotiate a way out of Zimbabwe does that mean that they will negotiate with a government of a non-existent state? Indeed can a government of non-existent state govern let alone exist?
The whole thing is riddled with flawed thinking and elementary mistakes that one would be forgiven in thinking that it was written by a pre-pubescent teenager caught in the angst of teenagehood!

The Unity accord of 1987 was a unity accord between Zanu-pf and Zapu-pf. It was not a unity accord between the Shona and the Ndebele - there is a distinction - it is possible to be Ndebele and not belong to Zapu or Shona and not belong to Zanu-pf.

This deeply flawed thinking of MPc of ukuthi bazatshaya umazivelela at time and place oftheir own choosing is misguided and when they eventually do tshaya lowo mazivelela they will find that the the ships has set sail without them


Whenever people agree with me I always feel I must be wrong

Stupid is forever, ignorance can be fixed.

A mind is only useful if it is open
Joined: Jan 2008
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Mafikizolo
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Really politics is all about who gets what when and how.l can not belive that Mugabe and Tswangilayi are making love at the expense of 12 million suffering Zimbabweans, beside where do we , Amandebele, benefit from this Mgabe and tswangilayi affair


sengikhona njalo
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when pple like oJazi tell the truth, not only the truth but inspiring truth, Real Ndebele's are easily identified by their failure to acknowledge their weakness and learn from there.

What can you say of people who have dismally failed to hold on to their space, but whose birthrate is as low yet they know that their hope of survival as a people lies squarely in the nextgeneration to come. a people who are easily manipulated and used by a certain tribe to suppress their own.

all i can say is well done boJazi, Munt'onela kudla and company for laying facts as they are!

Joined: May 2007
Posts: 41
Mafikizolo
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Mafikizolo
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Originally Posted by Bhudaza
Forgive me if I am mistaken but did Tshwankilayi participate in the recent presidential election?

NO!

Originally Posted by Bhudaza
Have their MPs or councillors been sworn in.

NO!

It is hard to argue against the facts you laid above Bhudaza, why don't we argue about the "state" instead?


"Some people believe football is a matter of life and death, ...I can assure you it is much, much more important than that." Bill Shankly.
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