Uma ngihlaziya incwadi ezinengi zikamthwakazi zilombono wokuthi ilizwe liqamukane phakathi kube yiMaNdebele le Matshabiland. I am not sure if that will ever benefit anyone let alone be possible. Tribal hang ups must end if we are to have a Ndebele president in Zimbabwe whether in 50 or 100 years time because the tribalist coments that we make all the time will never benefit anyone but make the diferences remain distinct and marginalise the Mthwakazi nation even more, and will therefore be passed to future generations. Bantu bakithi, its high time we started to think positive and work together to solve the crisis in Zimbabwe regardless of tribe, race or creed. We now have lots of intermarriages and lots of ndebeles in Mashonaland and vice versa which shows that we are one nation and therefore one people. Regional politics will never work in any society, and ask Mangosuthu Buthelezi (SA) and think of the support Umqabuko had koMthwakazi but never succeeded. In my own view, the Mdc pro-senate group should forget it if they think they can do it as Ndebeles only except if they are only doing it for personal gains despite the fact that Tswangirai is a dictator like Bob.These guys should re-unite with Tswangson camp and fight for change in leadership except if they are now part of Zanu PF as some reports suggest. I feel sorry for the people who queue to cast their votes all these years when they are being taken for a ride. Lets be one bantu bakithi and work together to send mugabe and his gangsters packing.

well said wena kaMalandela. if you think we as Mthwakazians in this forum are desperately hanging on tribal politics, check this site and come back lezicaphuno www.zimdaily.com

Yini into okuthiwa yitribe Bryton Zulu? Yini into okuthiwa yitribal politics? UMthwakazi yiTribe noma yisizwe Bryton Zulu? Kusiza ngani lokho okushoyo vele?

Imibuzo yakho Sibambamahawu ayizwakali ukuthi ifunani. Can u pliz ask clear and costructive questions and maybe make some contributions if u have any!

Zulu boy
Wena uthi ukugqilazwa kukaMthwakazi yinkululeko yakhe angithi? Wena ucabanga ukuthi ukuphuma kukaMgabe esihlalweni sombuso ukugqilazwa kukaMthwakazi kuzobe sekuphelile angithi? Ndoda uma wena usuphonse ithawula ungacabngi ukuthi nathi sesilahlile ithemba. Thina sizoyibamba inzima, sizicandele eyethu indlela, sizilimele yona eyethu insimu, kunzima kunjalo. Sizoyibamba indima ndoda, kuzothi lapho nawe ophaphamela khona usijoyine. Lenqola yomlilo kaMthwakazi ayingeke imiswe ngokuyimibonywana kwakho okufiphele.

Zulu Boy uthi wena!

We now have lots of intermarriages and lots of ndebeles in Mashonaland and vice versa which shows that we are one nation and therefore one people.

Think again! The intermarriages you are talking about have never been an impediment to the systemmatic preclusion of the Ndebele people. Sporadic marriages are no indication of national agendas, intentions, motives nor behaviours. What percentage of intermarriages are we talking about? (Allow me to be Jazelindizayo and demand statistics from you here?)

Mugabe taught at hope fountain mission, wafunda kwaZulu e Fort Hare, has two beautiful daughters Siphiwe and Sibonile lo MaNcube. Did that stop him from unleashing the Gukurahundi terror on Ndebeles?? I am told his step mother ngu MaTshuma. Is Mugabe one family/nation with his daughters and their mother? Could that be the reason esizonda? Who knows?

Sibambamahawu, if u think Matabeleland will one day be an independent state, dream on, only u and your Imbovane Yamahlabezulu & other such tribalist groups will die-dreaming! Amandebele aphila nge 21st century sesatshiya imicabango efipheleyo njengaleyo.Honstly, Mabila how can in your normal senses use Mugabe as an example on such things? who doesnt know that Mugabe is a tribalist devil! Pliz lets be serious guyz.

Mugabe represents an interested tribal grouping in Zimbabwe. It would be naive to assume that he acts alone and that those he represents are against his actions in toto. UMugabe uyavotelwa luhlangothi oluthile consistently kwele Mzimatshe!

My dispute with your post earlier hinges on your assertion that intermarriages are a sign of a united nation and you have elected not to repsond to that!

Zulu uhambile na ezimdaily bayakutshela abakucabangayo ngamaNdebele.

Sibamba kulomunye undoda esimaziyo sonke kweleMelika wathi "I HAVE A DREAM..." and indeed you need a dream sometimes called a vision. but ngilusizi nxa njengoMthwakazi sicabanga ukuthi inhlupho zethu zoqedwa yikufa kukamgabe engafikisa 100 years which means 16 or so more years of servitude. wow! what a generation!

Has anyone suggested that inhlupho zika Mthwakazi ziyoqedwa yikufa kuka Mgabe?? Really?
I think we have belaboured the point that our salvation lies in structural and constitutional changes kwele Mzimatshe and hence the furious debates on federation and secession issues.

Mr. Zulu Boy what you have written about Mthwakazi above is interesting indeed. It is interesting in the sense that you have come to convince yourself that the people of Mthwakazi are the devils and the tribalists of Zimbabwe while on the contrary you have convinced yourself that the Shona people are the angels and doves of Zimbabwe and are therefore non-tribalist. Amazing indeed. You believe that Ndebeles are suffering from 'tribal hang-ups'(Mzwakhe Mbuli, please quote him) and hence denouncing them for their 'bad behaviour' and making an appeal for them to join their subjugators and oppressors to liberate Zimbabwe once again and be ruled by another dictator again. This is amazing indeed.

Were the black naionalists that fought for the liberation of Zimbabwe racist when they were taking the struggle to the door-step of Ian Smith and his racist cronies? What is tribal with the issue of Ndebeles taking the struggle to liberate themselves from tribal hegemony and marginalisation to the door-step of their oppressors and killers, namely the Shona people? According to your line of reasoning, you would rather prefer the Ndebeles to shove their heads in the sand like a sad ostrich and pretend that no harm is being perpetrated against them and be happy and jolly and move on with their lives in that country as if nothing is taking place against their existence. Mfowethu that will be defeatist to the extreme and if we were to continue pandering to the tribalist whims of our oppressors, our nation will be as good as a dead nation. There are serious issues at stake for our people here, more than these so called marriages that people sing about.

The other thing I found interesting in your contribution is to accuse Ncube and Co. of tribalism while you seem to think that Morgan and Co. are not tribalist. First and foremost this Ncube and Morgan saga has been tribalised by Morgan himself and his tribalist hangers-on and people like you who endlessly accuse Ncube of tribalism. For Ncube and Co. this issue has always been to do with democracy within the MDC party and the violation of the MDC constitution by Morgan after the NEC senate vote. We all know that the NEC voted 33 to 31 to participate in the senate and that once Morgan like everyone else within MDC had put this issue to be decided through the ballot box, he and the rest were supposed to adhere to the democratic outcome of that vote. What happened? Is it becoz the Ndebeles were suffering from these 'tribal hangs-ups' that you talk about that led to this division within MDC? Were those 33 votes coming from Matebeleland only that Ncube and co. can be accused of tribalism for fighting a would-be dictator in the form and shape of Morgan? Morgan has been exposed as a dictator and as Ndebeles who have suffered under the dictatorship of Mugabe, should we in our right minds support another would be dictator?

I ma not a supporter of MDC but I have always symapthised with our people in the MDC party and their relentless effort to fight a dictator that is Mugabe. It will be wrong for them to sit on their backs, be silent, support and create another dictator of the prototype of Mugabe just becoz if they dared challenge a Shona leader's dictatorial tendencies, then they will be accused of being tribalists.

Ncube and co. have become my heroes in this case. I salute them.

Zulu boy

Kulosizi nxa kuzathiwa uMthwakazi is short sighted, kumele avale umlomo avulele ukubayizichaka zomhlobo owodwa. Izinto ezenzakala khathesi are there to entrench umhlobo owodwa. Have you set down wananzelela imthetho okhona nge citizenship ye Zimbabwe?

Let me share something with you (a cunning strategy that is designed to end okwaqalwa yiGukura). Umthetho okhona uthi wona umuntu olabazali (any one of the two) ongazalelwanga eZimbabwe is an alien. At face value, kwakungathi it was targetted at abantwini be Malawi, Mozambique and Zambia. Babuya batshada labantu besiNdebele kwazalwa inengi lethu (witness inengi elise Matshobana, Sizinda lamanye amalokitshi which have a sprinkling of mixed marriages). Most of the children from these families abakaze bayefika leMalawi, Mozambique and all, but namuhla sebesaziwa as aliens, ama foreigners. Project that further, abantu abalabazali abazalelwa eZansi Africa will be affected!!

Nxa i passport yakho i expire, uthi ubuyela usiya extenda, if any of one of the 2 parents nxa wazalelwa outside Zimbabwe, uyathathelwa isithupha uphiwe esokuba yi foreigner. You know what that means? No more nduna or sobhuku and without those, kuzabanzima to get imizi, bank facilities, amalungelo amanengi ngoba we are now foreigners!

ungakunanzelela kuhle uzathola ukuthi ebatshabini, the influence of abantu from Malawi, Mozambique, South Africa, Botswana and Zambia is not as huge as it is in Bulawayo. Ngingabe ngiphazamile on this take (in the absence of statistics), but what we are seeing is a calculated expulsion and eradication of isizwe sika Mthwakazi.

Capitulation - not in my life time!

Mpthu, wena ozibiza Zulu boy. Ngithi ulahlekile jaha, yikhona nje uzibiza Zulu boy, nganxanye uphika ubuThwakazi bakho ngokusingatha ubuZulu,nganxanye usingathe ukugqilazwa ngokuzibiza 'Bhoyi'. Nxa wena uliNdebele, njengoba utsho, eliphila nge21st Century, phuma lapha uyeku NewZim kumbe okunye okungamaxhaphozi kobutshabi, uyekele thina bakaMthwakazi sizenzele.

Ngisake ngiyefika ngale ngaku 'Name and shame' ngiyojikela igama lakho. Mpthu, lokuziqakisa kwakho uzenza ongcono wena uzibiza 'bhoyi'!

KoweNgotsha,

Utsho uqinisile mnakwethu, mina mselufu ngingomunye walaba asebethwele nzima ngoba ngizalwa yintombi yoMswazi. Leyontombi ayisenaso isithupha sakomkhenkethe isibhekane lobunzima. Kulezinye izihlobo lazo ezizalwa zintombi zaseMzansi, abazali sebebizwa aliyeni, sebehlala emzansi, bengasebenzi, besondlwa ngabantwana abako mkhenkethe, okusegcekeni ukuthi yinto enzima ukuyiqhuba (Dollar supporting Rand? Impossible!)

ngikuqondise ke jahana. First and foremost, mina ngingu Zulu not UmZulu and dont be daft, boy means umfana ngesiNdebele hayikhona bhoyi fethu!. My father was Zambian and when my passport expired in 2001, I was asked to go and renounce my Zambian Citizenship even though I 've never set foot in Zambia. I did that and now got a Zim passport. So I dont know how accurate your claims are. Secondly, I've freedom of expression, so nxa ufuna ukuthi abantu bonke babe lombono obolileyo njengowakho, then awutshiyananga loMugabe umehluko yikuthi wena awulangitsho le nja oyikhokhelayo kukanti iwele lakho uBob likhokhela iZimbabwe! Rest in peace.

Hawu sengikhona mina ukhabazela uMkhize ozikhizayo imnandi lindatshana eliphupho elingeke lifezeke kuZulu boy lakuwe Lembe njengoba usitsho mfewethu mina into esengiyisole kakhulu kuwe ZuluBoy yikubamba umntwana wenkosi ngekhola wena nguwe oqale lindaba ngakho kumele ulindile yonke inhlamba uphendule wonke umuntu ngobufakazi bakho olabo kodwa ngenhlamba lokubamba kwakho lujaha ngekhola indaba yakho ukhohlwe ukuthi uyasoma.

Engibe buhlungu khona kakhulu yikweyisa uzulu ngezifiso lemicabango yabo ngabakufunayo(uzibuse)
ngeke ngikwethese igama elibuhlungu ngoba akusizi lutho njalo akwakhi.Igama engizakwethesa lona ngelokuthi akulamehluko phakathi komcabango wakho lomuntu wesitshabini.I - 21st century ngeyakho baba imcabango yethu ayifani leyakho masesisiya kwezikamagebhula.

Masewulime eyakho indima wehluleka ukuyiqedisa sinikeze ithuba thina esiphethe imhlambi yenkomo siqedise.Ubuye wasithuka njalo ngokuthi silembono ebolileyo ngakho ngikufanisa loTswangilayi othi itshumi lanye kulingana letshumi lantathu ngoba sonke ngeke sibe lembono efanayo kutsho ukuthi umuntu angaba lombono ohlukene lowakho akufanelanga uphikiswe.

Uhambelana lomgabe feya baba njalo hlonipha abantwana benkosi ungazobabiza abantu ababandlululayo(tribalist) ngoba ngezinye indlela uthakazelela isitha ngabokhokho abababulalayo inhliziyo zilokhe zibuhlungu angazi kumbe uphethe eyensimbi.


MTHWAKAZI FOR LIFE ISIKUBA SIVELE SIFANELE UKUKHITSHWA PHAKATHI KWEMPUPHU.

Wena we Ngotsha Segro,wena wenkangala Sphepheli, kanye loMkhize uKhabazela phela ..... kanti abadala babethi ma bephethe indaba enkulu engangobaba asuse omunye kuthiwe ayohlinza imbuzi kodwa abafana bekhona kwakusuke kutheni .

Futhi futhi liyazi lonke ukuthi abanye yinsizwa insizwa zingekho abanye yinsizwa insizwa zikhona
so ngithi mina 1+1 kunga ngu 2 kumbe 11... hk hk

Zulubhoyi

only those who can see the invisible can do the impossible. nxa ungaliboni iphupho it's not your problem, you are just a product of a system.

There are those who wonder why things happen, those who marvel at things when they happen, those who scoff at things as they happen and finally a group to which you do not belong, those who make things happen.

Zuluboy,

I suggest that you leave this matter to the Mthwakazi people. The act of capitulation is not an option in our noble quest for the solving the problems in our society. Unless, if you have spent the past 30 years in a grotto, you will not fail to know about the grand-plan and its effects.

I will not try to engage into a discussion with you at this moment. If you really want to make a sound contribution, read and understandthe grand-plan, visit the zimdaily website as suggested above and foremost try to use logical deduction to derive who is at fault, before making jejune and witless opinions.

The attack that you raise on Siphepheli, is simply a childish popinjay shriek, which is in view of trying to undermine his character by comparing him with mgabe. Unfortunately, you don't know anything about him, so your claims are unfounded and not only ridiculous, but garbled beyond comprehension.

ZULU BOY

Quote
Uma ngihlaziya incwadi ezinengi zikamthwakazi zilombono wokuthi ilizwe liqamukane phakathi kube yiMaNdebele le Matshabiland. I am not sure if that will ever benefit anyone let alone be possible. Tribal hang ups must end if we are to have a Ndebele president in Zimbabwe whether in 50 or 100 years time because the tribalist coments that we make all the time will never benefit anyone but make the diferences remain distinct and marginalise the Mthwakazi nation even more, and will therefore be passed to future generations. Bantu bakithi, its high time we started to think positive and work together to solve the crisis in Zimbabwe regardless of tribe, race or creed. We now have lots of intermarriages and lots of ndebeles in Mashonaland and vice versa which shows that we are one nation and therefore one people. Regional politics will never work in any society, and ask Mangosuthu Buthelezi (SA) and think of the support Umqabuko had koMthwakazi but never succeeded. In my own view, the Mdc pro-senate group should forget it if they think they can do it as Ndebeles only except if they are only doing it for personal gains despite the fact that Tswangirai is a dictator like Bob.These guys should re-unite with Tswangson camp and fight for change in leadership except if they are now part of Zanu PF as some reports suggest. I feel sorry for the people who queue to cast their votes all these years when they are being taken for a ride. Lets be one bantu bakithi and work together to send mugabe and his gangsters packing.

You should note that whereas both Ndebeles and the MDC Shonas are against ZANU, the grievances of the two are different. Ours as Ndebeles date as far back as the 80s when these guys massacred us simply because we are Ndebele. This was done as part of executing their grand plan and they have never stopped executing it. However the MDC's grievances have absolutely nothing to do with what happened & is happenning to the Ndebeles. They have their own problems which eventually gave birth to the formation of the MDC. Are you aware ukuthi the Shona sect that has spearhearded the formation of MDC was unmoved when ZANU was butchering the Ndebeles in the 80s, that is why they never turned against ZANU then. That is why they did not ever dream of forming any political party, until they were grieved. The more Ndebele blood was spilled, the happier they were. While we suffered, to them 'Dissidents' were being rewarded accordingly,it was good riddance of some prevailing menace. If that status quo had been mantained, they would have had absolutely no problems. Ngokunjalo if today they are fighting against their big brother, wena njengeNdebele nxa uhlangene kahle ekhanda what makes you think ukuthi your welfare is their concern? What makes you think that there is a solution for the Ndebeles in teaming up with them? Shame on you 'boy'. The impression that I'm getting from your write up Zulu Boy yikuthi the nature of your problems are typical of those of the Shona sect which is turning against Mugabe & not the Mthwakazi's. Ngokunjalo yikho ulemikhumbulo le oza layo lapha. Unfortunately it is to the wrong people because thina as Mthwakazi we have our own problems atshiyene khatshana lawenu bantu be MDC.
Inkinga esilayo njengoMthwakazi ngabantu abafana lani Zulu boy who are easily blinded and hence used by Shonas to achieve their goals. Khonamanje iMDC ubungathi yiparty yemihlobo yonke eZimbabwe but if you follow the sentiments being aired by the leadership, they hate Ndebeles - period. They only recruited them in a quest to oust ZANU thru the ballot. There after if they had won, they would have flushed us off. Unfortunately we have such persons as you Zulu Boy who have an impaired foresight. Liphaphama selidume ledlula, beselikhala isililo esingaphathisiyo.

ZuluBoy

Since Nomandebele i have been waiting for people like you,before i say whatever i am going to say i suggest you send one more post so that i will know you are still around,i am waiting.pending....................

I guess the point is we should acknowledge our differences and know that we as a Ndebele nation are capable and able to solve our problems .... however what we must do is realise is the need for the Logistics behind the separation idea.....
also the question is ...is it a feasible and achievable idea... personally no im sure( its just another dream that our generation will not see ) other people will say otherwise

** We did highlight these on one of the post about the need to know our strengths in being a separate state...

***Again the economics behind this proposed isolation ..even as a country or state we should realise the need of other states for survival...***

I think the whole point is agree that we do not like each other but realise that we need each other for survival

uthi wena

quote:

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Tribal hang up must end if we are to have a Ndebele president in Zimbabwe...

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my friend zezuruboy, 't seems you don't get it. we don,t need a Ndebele president, my friend we need our freedom and criminals to be brought to justice. Tell me what's good for Mthwakazi if Dumiso, Sithembiso, John or other Mthwakazi Zanu Pf trash be made president tomorrow. This time it's all or nothing.

some will scoff at the idea of a free Mthwakazi as Ian did at the idea of black majority rule, kayivuma na imajorithi?

nice picture though hk hk.

Bakithi ngiyalibonga ngeselikwenze lapha. Ku zululiyana ngithi khwaza uwohloke jaha, engxenye ungaphaphama. Mina sili elidala ngikulindele ngithi woza ekhaya, noma sesahlala embhalwini nje.

Zulu boy

Like i said that my answer to you was pending for 24 hours you didnt even have the guts to come and answer to the quastions,i guess i will say you saw it coming ngoba ungahlokoza inyosi emlindini wazo sezikuluma ungakhali.Into leyi ngeke ilale ngingakakutsheli okusenhliziyweni yami.

First of all wisemen gather all necessary and relevent facts before they approach sensitive issues,you are obviously not one of those.I have with all simplicity and sensitivity tried to articulate my points and tried to understand what excatly is your point but i have only come up with one word,crap.

You have noticed these tribal hangups on ndebeles,what about what these people talking about"mandeere akatitorera nyika yedu".i could not believe you are undermining Ncube,Mdawini and Nyathi one of your own if you are ndebele at all,who have at least publicly told Mgabe their piece of minds,would you?Thinking for a second that ndebeles cannot do it by themselves is insanity at its highest levels.Yes if Ncube and co think that oneday they will rule shonas they are wrong because shonas will never accept any ndebele leader,so what do you call that?

What intermarriages are you talking about and how many have lasted,who can stop people from falling in love,haven't you read the biggest love story of all time romio and juliet,wheren't their parents enermies,you must be a fool that does not see what these people are upto,you are saying we should reunite with these people and help them remove Mgabe after that they will do exactly what has been doing for the past three and half decades.

Now coming to what you said to Sphepheli,that was absolute bollocks,he will never be even at gun point be like Mgabe,ngizwe ngani uthe you originate from Zambia,thats why you have no sense of belonging,ufana lezalizelwe emzini wakoSibanda,ngumtwana walaph'ekhaya kodwa nxa sekhulile uyazikhethela ukuthi uyakoyise omzalayo kumbe lapha ondliwe khona,but people like Sphehpeli have no ather alternatives,they are ndebele no compromise.Ezomdeni tshiyana lazo ziyakuvusela okunengi,if you are ndebele for sure just clear off you man of little faith.Mthwakazi will be free with or without you.

Remember,the secret to success is understanding the potatial within you and all cowards are best known for,instead of addressing their weaknesses they turn to pass hypocritical judgements to other people.

My new years resolution is zero tolarance to people like you.Sengitshilo mina okaMcambalali okungayisikufa yikuphi.

You rest in peace.

Mahlabay'thwale!

If everyone lobbying for a Mthwakazi nation has got the same views like u, who think that to be Ndebele, both your parents should be Ndebele, then rest in pieces jaha elidala. Remember we have non-ndebeles in Matabeleland like the Sothos(Gwanda), vendas (b/bridge), kalangas, Nyanjas& others in Wankie, Tongas, etc plus us the aliens (if u want to call us), then who r u left with to make your so called mthwakazi nation? stupid idea innit? Food for thought!

uMthwakazi ugoqela yonke imhlobo ngaphandle kwetshabi ngoba libuya leeeeeeeeee esitshonaland.
Ucabanga ukuthi ungadiffer sizothi ungcono cha baba abantu kufanele bekhululwe emaketaneni esambane.

Zuluboy

If you are ndebele why are you looking at things at a tshabi perspective,my mum is swathi too and i did not say you are not ndebele your ideas made me compromise otherwise.

Zwangendaba

akuncede uzulubhoyi umchazele ukuthi ngobani amaNdebele.

Zulu zulu buya sidl' amakhomane

quote:

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Originally posted by Zulu boy:
ngikuqondise ke jahana. First and foremost, mina ngingu Zulu not UmZulu and dont be daft, boy means umfana ngesiNdebele hayikhona bhoyi fethu!. My father was Zambian and when my passport expired in 2001, I was asked to go and renounce my Zambian Citizenship even though I 've never set foot in Zambia. I did that and now got a Zim passport. So I dont know how accurate your claims are. Secondly, I've freedom of expression, so nxa ufuna ukuthi abantu bonke babe lombono obolileyo njengowakho, then awutshiyananga loMugabe umehluko yikuthi wena awulangitsho le nja oyikhokhelayo kukanti iwele lakho uBob likhokhela iZimbabwe! Rest in peace.

---

Usawakhumbula na lawa magama ndoda? Manje ubona angani ozavuma ukukukhokhela wena ulemibono enje ngubani?

Asazi mnakwethu!

Zuluboy

we,mfokamdala,we as Mthwakazians we have been maginalised and victimised since the so called Zimbagwe was born,who do u want to comprimise with? whom do u want to respect u and understand u?everyone has a right to live, survive,exist or die in a decent manner,these are the rights bethroned to anyone of us by our creator,Why should I negotiate and try to forge a relationship with the devel,the real enemy of my existance.Mina ngithi bafo,Mthwakazi state is my birth right,its not a benefit neither negotiable,I've got a right to survive by any means necessary.Why should I forge any relationship with Ama***** who mamed,butcherd, raped my people.Zero tolerance for all those castigators and till hell break loose,I will stay loyal to my Mthwakazi people,if there is anything, any knowledge,any joke,any wisdom,any loyalty,it will be for my own peaple.Call me a tribalistic guy.I will take it with a smile,,,...COZ FREEDOM IS COMING TOMORROW BY ANY MEANS NECESSARY,WATCH OUT REVOLUTION IS GATHERING MOMENTUM AND PLIZ,NEVER,NEVER,EVER....I SAY NEVER LET HISTORY REPEAT ITSELF.Gooday Brotherma.a.a.an.I invite U 2 take a vow now for the luv of Mthwakazi philanthropy.

we Zuluboy,Zuruman,Mzuuuuu...uru
Konje uthe udatshulwa ngamaZambia...hk hk hk hk akung'mangazi.ung'mgandane,ubhomporo,ulamthuthu,ulinkwankisi, ukuthi uzelwe kwaMthwakazi its just a taboo. U know my advice 2 u,go back a claim your citizenship in Zambia(ndola,kitwe,livingston,kafue or lusaka).Lana kukwaMthwakazi and we mean business,is'khathi sokudlala asinaso.I guess amaNyasa abantu bakini need u down there in Copperbelt to free them from poverty.A.a..aa..a..a...gh ..mani uyas'nyanyisa mpthu,buyel'khaya eM'Z>>>>>

JERICHO

Yiyo indlela owakhuliswa ngayo ukuthi nxa ukhuluma lomuntu olombono uze ukhafule . sengihle ngibone lendlela owakhuliswa ngayo . ungabe ungawuthandi umbono wakhe kodwa mhloniphe . wena nxa ukhangele loma uphupha ukubona ilizwe lingehlukaniswa phakathi just in your dreams ? asicabangeni njengabakhulileyo sibelomphathi okamthwakazi hatshi ukuthi sehlukanise ilizwe lokhu akusoze kwenzakala nomanini indluyenu igcwele ukuxokozela lokulwa . okutshiwo nguzulu kuliqiniso ngaphandle nxa liphupha loma liyengana kodwa nxa lifuna ukuba lomphathi kamthwakazi cabangani njengabantu abaku2006 not 1718


umhlangano ngowokubonisana hayi owokutshayana ngezitulo

sidlodlo

Hatshi boo lawe usuphambanisa ngokuthi siyayengana. Awulizwa wedwanje ukuthi ligama elinzima lelo yini wakwethu...kusobala ngokubala ukuthi nxa uzasebenzisa ukuthi 'ngaphandle nxa lisengana' wena uzifaka ngaphi lapho? Angaba ephambanisile u Jericho kodwa lawe futhi angikuvumeli ukuthi usitshele ukuphupha lokuyengana, hayi boo. Kanti ungenwe ntoni wakwethu? Hatshi bana lozwelo loMthwakazi wakwethu, sesakubonokukhulu bakithi kanti aliboni naa?

Njalo ungasitsheli ukucabanga njengabantu baka 1718 utshoni kanti lapho? Utshukuthi asicabangi kuhle singemva kwe sivilayizetshini kumbe loba utsholo ukuthi nxa sicabanga njengabantu baka1700's labo bantu babengacabangi kuhle? Hayi angivumi ngombono onjalo mina. ORO. Zamokunye wethu.

yebo BABA NGIYAKUZWA NJALO NXA NGIPHAMBANISILE NGIYAXOLISA . UMTHWAKAZI NGIMTHANDA KAKHULU . KODWA NXA LIKHANGELE LIBONA ILIZWE LINGADATSHULWA PHAKATHI NA? ASINCEDISANENI UKUKHIPHA UBOB HAYI UKUTHI SITHI AKUDATSHULWE ILIZWE , NGUPHI UMAKHELWANE ONGASAMUKELA PHELA IZIM SAYITHOLA NGOBA SIZWANA LABOMAKHELWANE, BAFOWETHU NGITHUKUTHELE LAMI NJENGANI KODWA KANGIFUNI UKUTHUKUTHELA KWAMI KUVALE UKUCABANGA KWAMI. KAMBE MUZI BANI OHLALA NGENHLAMBA BAFUNDENI ABANTWABETHU SIZAKHOMBISA NJUANI EZINYE IZIZWE UKUZE ZISAMUKELE ZIYATHI ZIYANGENA KUMTHWAKAZI ZITSHELWE NGESIKHALA EZAFIKA NGASO EMHLABENI . KHANGELANI UBUTHELEZI HE IS A GOOD EXAMPLE WAZAMA UKUYEHLUKANISA IMZANSI LALAMUHLA UDLA AMATHE AWE ANC. LINGABE LIHLAKANIPHILE LIFUNDILE KODWA INHLAMBA ZENU LOKUNGAFUNI UKUBONISANA ? LITHETHISANA LODWA NGOBA LINGAVUMELANI KUTSHO UKUTHI IF SINGAMTHOLA UZIBUSE ONGAVUMELANI LATHI UYABULAWA YIKHO PHELA OKWENZIWA YIZANU . MINA NGITHI MADODA ASIBAMBANENI SINGALWI SODWA LOKUDLA KUNGAKAFIKI PHAMBIKWETHU. UMTHWAKAZI NGIMAZI ENGUMUNTU OBONISANA LAMANYE AMADODA AMQOBE NGAMAZWI LANGOKUKHALIPHA HATSHI OTHI NGOBA ENGAVUMI USEBULAWA UMEHLUKO UKUPHI KHONAPHO LOMGABE LINGANGITHETHISA LINGIXOTSHE KODWA LIYABESELILUZE IVOTI ELILODWA PHELA ONQOBE NGOKUKODWA ULOKHU ENQOBILE

Sidlodlo

Kukhanya sengathi awula m'bono munye lathi sonke esithi kumele sehlukane leZimbabwe. Uthi wena "it's not possible to form a new state." Ngicela uvakatshele this website uzibonele ukuzalwa kwamanye amazwe. Then you can come back and we will start maping a way forward lawe usulom'bono munye lathi sonke. Try and concentrate on the velvet divorce kulink le. See how long it took them. Thina we have been on this struggle since the 60s we are now focused on the divorce ngoba yiyo istage esesikiyo kustruggle.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/country_profiles/1844842.stm

Sidlodlo

Ngiyabonga mfowethu,kodwa umbuzo wami mina ngithi,bewukuphi sonke les'khathi? angideleli mfo,njalo ngikhuliswe kahle njalo ngiyahlonipha.Uma umuntu angena kuleNkundla akhuluma umathanda angahloniphi ama elders ethu kule Inkundla uthi sibayeke,njalo sibalalele? mina ngeke ngikwenze lokho mfoka baba.Each and every movement has its own youth, military and advisory wing(identify yourself).Mina I will always be outspokeni and please..please, I stand to be corrected if I'm wrong.Believe me mfethu,I'lost 13 members of my family(brothers & uncles)in the past Zim era...so ungangi kathagorayizi,ngidedele ngikhulume umbono wami, at least I'm doing something about my situation.I'm drawing even your attention to this dialogue,yebo baba ngisase young...but I'lost a lot.Into engiyilwelayo ngiyayazi njalo I'm very open to anyone who can educate and show me the way foward.Ungaphindi and never uthi uyayi bona indlela engakhuliswa ngayo,don't disrespect me Mfo.I STILL SAY,REVOLUTION HAS BEGAN,IDENTIFY YOURSELF,SIZOLWA..SIPHIKISANE...SITHUKANE,NJALO SIXABANE UNTILL WE FIND A SOLUTION.ITS ALL IN THE PROCESS OF BUILDING ISIZWE SAKWA MTHWAKAZI....Welcome bafo to the freedom wagon,I deeply value your opinions I stand to be corrected.Its not personal its just part of the strugle.Dankie bafo....

Mkhize ozikhizayo

uxolo baba umangingazwakalanga kahle,mina yindaba angijabuli mangibona abantu abaza nemibono esibuyisela emnva,ukanti kudala sikhuluma lendaba yakoMthwakazi and ngile filingi yokuthi sesise duze la esiyakhona, ngoba sesisendleleni.I respect too much lina ama elders ethu elasungula Inkundla forum,so umuntu obuya akhulume into engiyibonayo ukuthi isibisela enva,ngithanda ukucebisana naye.Its been a long way for us to sacrifice the littly we have.Ngizo sekela leNkundla ngazo indlela if I can,pliz baba I stand to be corrected if I'm wrong...But ngiyazi FREEDOM is coming tomorrow.

Siyawabonga amazwi enu bafowethu nabodadewethu...makhul'impela, ayangikhulisa njalo ayangifundisa, okuzwayo fethu.

Okukhulu asifundeni ukuthi nxa umuntu ekuliNkundla ayisikhukuthi uyadlala lapha, ye mhlawumbe bakhona abalesikhathi sokudlalisa, kodwa ngokwazi kwami sonke sibhizokumangalisayo, abanye bayasetshenziswa ngendle'eziphansi bezamukudinga i Rand, i Pound, i $Can, kunye le US$. Kubuhlungu ungalalela abantwana besilo be naretha their situations, soke okungaba lula ayisikho kuthi babuye kuNkundla bazodlala, hayi okukhona uzakuya dinga lelo sheleni loba abuye kunkundla eze sthrathejaiza labanye...yikuphi kwakhona? Kusegcekeni bobaba nabomama.

Into nansi asakhaneni, akukho muntu ongaphambanisiyo, kodwa nxa nga singananzeleli impendulo zethu, ayaaa, ifa ngakithi. Silapha bazali, nalezi yuthi zethu hk hk (abafana abalomlilo hatshi asisoze sabathontisa laba bafana, kodwa sizohlalanibhobho siqondisane, phela ngabethu sizobalahla ? Nkani sizobatshela shhhhhhhh!! thula awusenzwukuthi uyaphi, aphendukesiporweni), silapha ngalinye, ende linyezwi. Ungezwa abantu bezikhipha inhlamba, ayisikhukuthi yinhlalayeza,loba ukuthi bakhuliswa njalo, hayi boooo ngumumo bakithi, like what the others have just alluded to, sesihleli kakhulu sikhulumisana labakaMthwakazi, sesiyazi into esingayo, soke abanye bangaba batsha kuliNkundla kodwa bafike bewubona umbono wabanengi, kuzekuthi abanye baqalise besadinga indawo yokuma kiyo siyatshiyana mahlabezulu, asihloniphaneni, singatshelani amagama, liyakubona khonokho, simunye (ngisayikhumbula ibhasi yekhaya eyayibhalwe esiphaqeni ukuthi SIMUNYE), yiso leso.

Umuntu angangena efuna ukusikhipha ku Equilibrium thina besesizwisisana, kuyacunula munyesikhathi. Yikho ubona lamajaha lezintombi zethu ze yuthi lezi hk hk zikugcwala...ayisikhukuthi zakhuliswa njalo hayi phepha baba ayisikho. Njalo ukufunda singakufaki phakathi ngoba nxa ufundile awufundanga nxa ungenzi kahle, hayi singakukhangeli okokufunda, kanti kuyini ukufunda? Ophu!!! sifuna abantu abakhisizwe sakwethu, abalembono, konke okuzakhulisa uMthwakazi. Masiyephambili bakhethu. UXOLO labana abazamukisi dhistraktha, asiyisiyolaboke, siyananzelela lapha mdala.

Ngiyabonga bafowethu ngempendulo zenu.Particular mention ka jaha u Jericho lo Mkhize Manyathela unyathele khona mpela, lani lonke bakithi, lawe sidlodlo lungisa nxa usekhaya pulizi, ngiyawaswelayinkulungwane ngabe ngiyalibongake kuhle, hatshi phephani bafowethu hayi siyakhula.

KoGodlwayo sijwayelukuthi nxa singakhuthana lomakhelwana, ngimnxuse siye donsa amabili loba amathathu phetsheya komfula emagrosa sixolisana, asambeni mani hk hk

Asibambeni kanye kanye khona kuzakubalula. bafowethu uba ngikhulume kabi ngiyaxolisa njengoba uGO...... ETSHILO WATHI KULABADALA NJALO AKUDLALWA KADE SAXOXA MANJE SIHLANGANA KUPHI BOBABA. ABAFUNDILEYO BATHI THINK AND TAKE ACTION LET US DO IT . NGINGALIHAMBELI PHAMBILI LOMFOWETHU I jericho nna ngikukhulumele kabi mayuyu baba .

l do not in any way despise the idea of an autonomous mthwakazi state but how realistic and archievable is this dream of ours ? are we not behaving in the manner of the BNP griffins who harbour a wishful idea to ethnically cleanse Britain of any foreigners?

Supposedly we do attain the total emancipation of the mthwakazi kingdom, are we not going to further or addtional autonomous states breakig away from the mthwakazi state eg the kalangas. the vendas, and the tongas.Honestly with the growing sense of tribal identification and cohesion of our kalanga neighbours cracks will appear sooner rather than later

The historic mthwakazic state was built largely through the military mightness of my forefathers, military supremacy was the chief reason why the indegenous population was co opted to form the greater mthwakazi state it was purely founded on subjugation.The subjugated indegeneous population though coopted into the state were in no way afforded equal privilidges accorded to the main nucleus of the ndebele society.My question is will the present day kalanga , venda and tonga folk view themselves as mthwakazi or its just a figment of our own imagination.

Present day zimbabwe has undergone tremendous metarmophosis, minority tribes are no longer shy to show their pride and joy in being who they are.

Sidlodlo, ngiyawabonga amazwi akho ungadinwa lakusasa! Jericho really needs psychiatric help becoz no one in their normal senses could produce such diarrhoea in front of all the Mthwakazi people! Seek emmediate help Jericho, pliz. If Umthwakazi thinks Jericho's verbal diarrhoea is good for this site and Umthwakazi, then there is no need to lobby for such a state becoz uzulu will start calling for its arbolition as soon as it come into existence (in dreams of course!) as lack of democracy will be at its lowest!

mmhhh asazi bakithi kunzimaa

Sidlodlo

Ngiyabonga ngombono wakho wethu. Hatshi labana abathi hee lokhu lalokho.. bakithi akuyisikho ukuthi silapha nje yikuthi sithi siyanyisana loba ukukhawulisana, hayi, sizamukwakha, soke ngikubonga kakhulu ngolimi olusebenzisileyo apha, uxolisa, laye u Jericho uyazizwela. Ukuxolisa kwakho kuyasisiza abanengi. EMthwakazi wethu.

Zulu Boy

hayi ndoda akulwiwa ngitsho, njalo akulasihudo lapha koMthwakazi, yizigwexa mnakwethu kuyatholakala ukuthi abantu bengakuzwisisi besebesebenzisa amagama mhlawumbe alukhuni ukuwezwa. Phepha bakithi. Asidonseni kanye kanye bakithi. Mukhululumsebenzi.

Sister H

Siyawabonga awakho. Kodwa khangela phela akula figment of our own imagination ekhona lapha. Siyazama ukwakha dadewethu, angazi siyaphosisa kukuphi, kodwa siyazama, kunzima nje kodwa hawuu amaphupho lawo azakuba yikho mpela ngolunyusuku.

Kulolu daba bakithi asizameni ukuba khonstrakhithivi, singadilizani, singabulalani izinhliziyo, mina ngisakhumbula ngisatshaya i 1500m e Matopo nxa kwakungelabo abangani abangikhuzayo bengipha amadlabuzane, ngangivele ngizingenisa kubo nhamba 2 loba 3 ukwenzela bangikhuze phela. Mina bayabe bekwazi ukuthi ngangiyathanyela kodwa ngizitshiyise nje ngibadinga, bazavungama nxa sengizitshiyisa besengidonsa imhlola. So asisebenzeni sincedisana, siwina siwinele isizwe hatshi uzibani.

Ngibongile mahlabezulu.

Wena Mahlaba????UfunA UKUNGIJWAYELA.JUST BCOZ I SEE THINGZ FROM A REALISTIC POINT OF VIEW AND DONOT AGREE WITH YOUR NARROW MINDEDNESS.Zulu Boy this forum kaMthwakazi does not take kindly to people who see thingz differently. i find it extrmely disturbing that when someone ask auestion like you have done abantu do not have the decency to answer without resorting to mud slinging and verbal venom.I would expect that of women but not men. Maybe i am right Mahlaba with the likes of you no wonder i think this Mthwakazi thing is just and will remain a dream. Can you imagine leaders like wena. I dialogue is the key not ukuthethisa abantu ngobawena you want them to see thingz your way. Shame!!!Politics ayifani leshabini you have to accept ukuthi abantu will not always agree with you and take it upon yourself to convince them to identify with your cause NOT ukupesuka nje uphakamise izidwaba. Put your handbag down Mahlaba , UZulu was just asking a question and expressing a view that many people out there have. Can we pliz have intelligent ,knowledgable intellectuals answer questions hayi abantu abanyiwe yishift taking their frustration on us

Zulu boy

angiguli bafo,dreams do comes true, kuzocaca

Bakwethu

Ngiyalicela bakithi lingaphoselani amagama kuliNkundla, ayisiyo ndlela yakhona.

nxa omunye wakho angakucunula kanti angithi singabhalelana ngasese silungisisigwenxa naa?

Akeni sakhane bakaMthwakazi. Kanti kungeneni laphekhaya? Mayuyu boo.

Besengibonile ukuthi abantu sesiphephisana, kube kuqondile lokhwaa, asenzeni njalo, pulazi sincedisane, kuyimvama sibili ukukhuthana enkulumweni. Asingeke sithwalelane langemkhonto siyebulala zhii imuli yomunye wethu, xolanini badala. Kambe kungaba ekhona ovoxayo nje ekholisa ukubona sithuzana yini? Thina siyakuvuma naa?

Akeni sithi dhiritshi, sibuyele muva mbijana, sibalekelibhanga leli. Shuwa singakwenza singazitshela siyenelisa ukukhuzana.

ASIMANYANENI BAKWETHU.

Vele kuyimvama njengoba ngitshilo; abantu kabakhuthani bafike ekuthwalelaneni induku ngomlomo nje kuphela, izigwenxa zikhona bantu.

Pholisani imimoya yenu.

The idea of an autonomous Mthwakazi state doesn’t imply tribalism. If someone can think in those lines definitely he’s out of line and lacks a vision of this struggle. Mthwakazi is for the people of Mthwakazi and does welcome other people who want to share our views of a better living.

Mthwakazi does comprise of many tribes/languages as we all know. We don’t want to segregate or discriminate people according to their tribal back ground or languages. We want to accommodate all languages and that’s the main reason for this struggle. We want every child to read, write, listen to the radio and watch TV in his own language. We know that this is possible if we cherish freedom and respect the needs of other people.

We choose people according to their values not tribe/language. Joshua Nkomo was a Kalanga and we all supported him in every way though in the end he betrayed us. The blame doesn’t fall on him alone; it falls on all the ZAPU leaders of that time. It’s not a matter of tribe or language here. It’s the personal qualities we cherish most.

It also doesn’t mean that Mthwakazi would be a one party state. We welcome opposition from every corner because we know it’s healthy. And Mthwakazi would encourage formation of opposition parties. It doesn’t mean that we fight against each other. It simple means that, there would other people observing us and seeing if we’re going the right direction.

Every tribe/language has a right to share the riches and benefits of this country. If one tribe is not content, it has the democratic right to express its concern. This is the world we want to create where there’s justice, freedom of expression and a safe haven.

ngiyethemba wonkumuntu wakoMthwakazi uyazi ukuthi sabandlululwa kusukisela i ZIM ithol' uzibuse, kuyangimangalisa ukuzwa umuntu ethu ukukhulul' uMTHWAKAZI yinto engalunganga esifananisa lo BNP, THINA SIFUNA UKUZIBUSASODWA. AKALIQUNYWE LELIZWEPHAKATHI, ngoba lababantu basempumalanga abasebenzekilabo khangela lamhlanje o tshangido sebezipha izihlalo, sebebullilizwe, babulala yonkinto,

ngiyalikhuthaza ukuthi asibambaneni silwise sizi khulule kulababantu basempumalanga

ngiyethemba wonkumuntu wakoMthwakazi uyazi ukuthi sabandlululwa kusukisela i ZIM ithol' uzibuse, kuyangimangalisa ukuzwa umuntu ethu ukukhulul' uMTHWAKAZI yinto engalunganga esifananisa lo BNP, THINA SIFUNA UKUZIBUSASODWA. AKALIQUNYWE LELIZWEPHAKATHI, ngoba lababantu basempumalanga abasebenzekilabo khangela lamhlanje o tshangido sebezipha izihlalo, sebebullilizwe, babulala yonkinto,

ngiyalikhuthaza ukuthi asibambaneni silwise sizi khulule kulababantu basempumalanga

Evamacelz

Siyalibonga lelo wakwethu. Kantike lathi besesimangelukuzwa omunye lapha engena ngaleyondlela.

Hatshi siyabonga mntanesilo.

Bafowethu.

YOU HAVE TO HOLD ON TO SOMETHING, even if it is a Dream, or YOU WILL FALL FOR ANYTHING.

Li Zwangendaba.

At this day and age i think we shld start channeling our efforts and finite resourses towards action, being conservative will not help siyaze sife silokhu sisithi this and that kungani siyathengisa...we shld take a leaf from our FATHERS ,MOTHERS,SISTAS AND BROTHERS WHO WON THE LIBERATION STRUGLLE.Even the SOWETO uprising must a motivator their agenda was a free and democratic South Africa.Lokhu ukuthi abantu bebe lokhu bephikisana angiboni kusakha.....sizafana le ZANU ethi where they address pple they say,"Simurenga, maBritish,we've built 10 dams,thats all crap and i think abanye bethu we have still got that mind since our zim education was littered with that garbage...uzwe seku khulunywa ngo changamile labo mambho whilst thina sifuna ukuzwa about relevant issues that affect us daily, food, jobs, security, health, education, economy..lest we forget that this forum was not created to serve the same purpose as "letters to the editor"

Your definitions or understanding is too generalised so much that although it fits your explanations it however does not represent or is not a fair generalisation of what goes on in life. You, for example seem to be suggesting that the current issues are separate from the past and liberation struggle. let me inform you that had it not been the British choice to give Mugabe power at the expense of those who had fought the struggle whole heartedly 'abantwana benhlabathi' we would not have ended up with what we have. this is the first reason why our history must inform our current and future choices. Only a society with historians will make the same mistake twice.

You view of South Africa as a purely democratic country is not differenty from the view that an ordinary Shona person had of Mugabe during the Matebeleland Cleasing period. That view is media conditioned and thus dangerously limiting and containing. Some South Africans need to be careful otherwise they will play the game we have played in no time at all. All people and societies must, as a birthright establish themselves on earth, demand and get their identity and nation. Every society must go beyond what those who forcefully nature it to believe, and defy established orders in order to establish its own order and therefore develop in accordance with the potentials of its people.

You seem to say that those who have raised the points above are following a tribal agenda, no! You seem to suggest that the staff they write is more like letters to the editor, no! What you are writing is! No bad blood but facts!

Have you noted that most Ndebeles are not tribalistic but conscious, infact Shona people, who naturally are not tribalist have been turned tribalist by the 1980s propaganda. Everytime you raise a pertinent issues on matabeleland they say its tribalistic, because tribalists want to keep other tribes below them. Thats tribalism, multiculturalism is about knowing that other groups see things differently from you. And that they may even want to live differently from you and that they think you are wrong sometimes.

The basic problem with your article is that it is informed by 'unity'! Unity is tribalism, in which one tribe dominates the other! But multicuturalism is when all societies accept difragmentation at a certain level and cooperation and coexistance at other levels. So with you coming from the unity stable I think what we need to solve your bread and butter issues is to redifine who we are and agree that we are who we are and the problems of our society will never end until such a think happens. Until we are all allowed to critic others, either as individuals or as groups, and allow them to hold valid perceptions about us, and fairly index us.

I ask you to rethink what the worth of life is if its root is that you must accept who they say you are and not complain because if you do then you are a tribalist.

Have you ever asked yourself why, for example the current MP of Insiza who is also a junior minister has Shona speaking bodygourds? Its because in their terms he is still a dissident who should be checked on frequently!

Well I have gone over my limit!

Proud to be Ndebele and I expect a Zezuru to be proud to be and shout it on the edges of the earth, just like I would do!

Your definitions or understanding, of tribalism, is too generalised so much that although it fits your explanations it however does not represent or is not a fair generalisation of what goes on in life. You, for example seem to be suggesting that the current issues are separate from the past and liberation struggle. Let me inform you that had it not been the British's calculated choice to give Mugabe power at the expense of those who had fought the struggle whole heartedly 'abantwana benhlabathi' we would not have ended up with what we have. This is the first reason why our history must inform our current and future choices. Only a society with historians will make the same mistake twice.

Your view of the current South African politic, as a purely democratic country is not different from the view that an ordinary Shona person had of Mugabe during the Matebeleland Cleansing period. That view is media conditioned and thus dangerously limiting and containing. Some South Africans need to be careful otherwise they will play the game we have played in no time at all. All people and societies must, as a birthright establish themselves on earth, demand and get their identity and nation. Every society must go beyond what those who forcefully nature it to believe, want them to believe, and defy established orders in order to establish its own order and therefore develop in accordance with the potentials of its people.

You seem to say that those who have raised the points above are following a tribal agenda, no! You seem to suggest that the staff they write is more like letters to the editor, no! What you are writing is! No bad blood but facts!

Have you noted that most Ndebeles are not tribalistic but conscious, infact Shona people, who naturally are not tribalist have been turned tribalist by the 1980s propaganda. Everytime one raise a pertinent issues on Matabeleland they say its tribalistic, because tribalists want to keep other tribes below them, and in total and voluntary submission. Thats tribalism, multiculturalism is about knowing that other groups see things differently from you. And that they may even want to live differently from you and that they think you are wrong sometimes.

The basic problem with your article is that it is informed by 'unity'! Unity is tribalism, in which one tribe dominates the other! But multicuturalism is when all societies accept defragmentation at a certain level and cooperation and coexistance at other levels. So with you coming from the unity stable I think what we need to solve 'your bread and butter issues' is to redifine who we are and agree that we are who we are and the problems of our society will never end until such a thing happens. Until we are all allowed to critic others, either as individuals or as groups, and allow them to hold valid perceptions about us, and fairly index us.

I ask you to rethink what the worth of life is if its root is that you must accept who they say you are and not complain because if you do then you are a tribalist.

Have you ever asked yourself why, for example the current MP of Insiza who is also a junior minister has Shona speaking bodygourds? Its because in their terms he is still a dissident who should be checked on frequently!

Well I have gone over my limit!

Proud to be Ndebele and I expect a Zezuru to be proud to be and shout it on the edges of the earth, just like I would do!

Quick response to Sidlodlo and Sister H

While I respect your views on the diversities that are present within the Mthwakazi state,(as they are in any society, let alone state allover the world) I do not think they should be a reason at all for the people of Umthwakazi, at least those who want a separate state, to stop demanding and indeed have it. If another tribe wants a state they would also be within their right to do so. To stop them from doing so will be wrong and will be done using the same mechanisms that Mugabe uses and that will be wrong from inserption to finish.

It is not imagination it is reality. Let me offer you a definition of a state that is generally accepted world over. Infact for something to be called a state it should have four basic characteristic, and these are 1) geographic space - land, 2) a political system - government, 3)a population - it could be 70 000 as in Western Sahara and 4) some level of international recognition - this is not a strict necessity.

So if any group of people anywhere in this world can have these things they should be allowed to be independent, why stay with people who do not want to stay with you? Of course in doing so there most be reasonable considerations, note reasonable not forced considerations, thus I believe that even if the Mthwakazi state would degenerate it would do so to a reasonable level.

So the excuses are simple and limited to a common school of thinking that has no justification in either democracy or the science of nationhood and brotherly nationhood. In the interest of democracy such a debate should not be promoted because it is informed by oppression and domination principles. Its like 'so if we break away from the Zezuru dominated Zimbabwe will we be able to dominate other groups amongst us?' I hate this kind of thinking, in fact it should be 'if we break away will that encourage other groups to seek their own freedom if they feel oppressed?' That is the question I would rather ask!

I think we are back to sqaure one, is the Mthwakazi state necessary (realistic yes it is?) if so go for it if not how can we build a common nation within the current divide?

Son of Mthwakazi (dissident by the Mugabe defination and law loving and abiding citizen by nature)

Gay'gusu

Mfowethu ubeke kahle izimvo zakho kuyathokozisa imbala ukwazi ukuthi baningi ovulingqondo kwaMthwakazi,ngesingisi bathi "people like you are like a breadth of fresh air".Kuyabongeka mntwan'omhlabathi!

i beg to differ with ur opinion you seem to be attacking me as an individual and trying o to patronise me at the same time and there is no way am gonna fall for that. i f we differ in idealogies i think you got to persue your on way of thinking and stop trying to change my core beliefs. if you chose to dwell in the past by all means do so and when you get the results pls do foward them to us. dont tell me to open my mind , do the same with yours my friend. in my posting there is no tribalistic connotations or what so eva its only you who is trying to blend it in. ok fine hlala le history yakho and discard my ideas....but i think every body is entitled to their opinion so wena dont tell me what to say?multiculturisms what for?will you eva live to see that?kodwa i think you should be paying attention to what i said and critique it not make it up..

I respect your views and ideology and will always be bent on doing that at every corner, thus if in any of my writings I have waivered and shown something to the contrary , let me say it a mistake of language. I do not however apologise for a mistake I make without intention, but merely recognise it as such if it is there.

However I have not said in my article that you have been tribalistic in your writings. No I have said your writings depict a prejudiced school of thought, and that is what I make out of what you write. As a matter of fact you could as a result be an unaware tribalist, by your in built knowledges and perceptions of things.

There are as a matter of fact a lot of multicutural societies. And I do not need to live a lot longer to see that. Not to say that there are model multicultural societies, no! But they exist and are by far better than the 'unity' societies.

I therefore submit that I do not target you but your views I do react to but I respect them though. You however have no reasonable right to hold on to ideas that don't work because they are yours, I would not do that! But no one has the right either to tell you that. People who enjoy that right are refered to in strange names but I would not use such strange names because they are retrogressive. Words like dogmatic and naive are used, but for fear of bieng misunderstood and because I do not yet have a personal relation with you, yet, I would not use them. Which I hope we can build!

I will read further on unity and see if it works but from what I see, the world has even moved from the so called governments of national unity to call them coalition governments, this is to depict inherent differences and to respect them while having a nation of equal people. Not the enequality, oppression and abuse that's embedded in 'unity'

So my friend I am a tribe, and I make not apology for that, and you can can not unite tribes because by their nature they are different but they can live side by side in peace. Thats is not unity but multitribalism if you do not like the word multicuture!

I am not Mthwakazian by choice but I defend bieng such by violent choice!


Thank you for the discourse, it is only this way that we grow!

Maqhamelizi

Mfowethu kasakheni isizwe sakwethu, and build based on the uniqueness of its citizens and its people!

Gay'gusu.
I just want to draw your attention to my understanding of the gist of Tallman's posting. In a nutshell, I think he is basically calling for action, hence he gives the Soweto uprising as an example. I think his reference to " letters to the editor" means he thinks we have become just a talk shoip.

Otherwise the rest of your posting is indeed a breath of fresh air

Mthwakazi omuhle,akelibale lapha lizizwele.

http://www.newzimbabwe.com/pages/gukgenocide16.13763.html


New Political Party Formed In Bulawayo
Wednesday, February 15 2006 @ 09:03 AM GMT
Contributed by: correspondent
A new political party has been formed in the second city of Zimbabwe, Bulawayo. The Patriotic Union of Matabeleland, (PUMA) is expected to formally announce its agenda early in March. At the moment, officials remain tight-lipped over their political intentions citing security concerns. The new political outfit, fronted by a group of civic leaders and political activists from Matabeleland and Midlands provinces, is set to represent the interests of the provinces which have remained largely undeveloped. Ndebele speaking people are the majority of the inhabitants of the region.

President Robert Mugabe, a Zezuru heads a cabinet dominated by ministers from his tribe, fuelling disgruntlement from politicians from other tribes. Among a host of nagging problems in Matabeleland, water remains critically short and plans by the Zanu PF government to undertake the Zambezi Matabeleland Water project have not succeeded.

Former Zimbabwe Teachers Association Leader (Zimta) leader, Leonard Nkala, is reported to have set up a 45-member executive committee, which will spearhead the launch of PUMA. Former Zanu-PF Bulawayo spokesperson, Sikhumbuzo Ndiweni, who is the party’s interim secretary general, said they were also working on the establishment of external wings, one focusing on Southern Africa, and another on the rest of the world. “We are currently working on setting up our structures, but everything would be complete on time for the official launch.

Some of our members are drawn from the ruling party, as well as both factions of the MDC. The interest from the diaspora is also very overwhelming,” said Ndiweni. A source in the party said PUMA’s promoters felt that they could capitalise on the fact that people in the area still had fresh memories of an 80’s crack military operation code named Gukurahundi.

The operation conducted by the Zimbabwe’s North Korean trained Fifth Brigade, left an estimated 20 000 civilians dead as soldiers sniff out a few dissidents who operated in the area. Up to now survivors of the operation have not been compensated and this remains a major source of disgruntlement. Zimbabwe’s main opposition party, the Movement for Democratic Change (MDC) draws the bulwark of its support from this region. Officials of PUMA have in the past few weeks held meetings with students at universities and teachers colleges. The new party joins the fray at a a time when MDC is threatened with a split.

source:zimdaily.com

Manje Malimaza ususitshiya silengile ungasasitsheli ukuthi uthini ngalokho!

Iarticle ebhalwe ngumasalad we newzimba ngivumelana layo ngoba imbono yakhe to me kukhanya angani ukhulumela kundaba yefedarism.Ngathi ngikhuluma lelinye itshabi lathi kimi lina mandebele nxa lisesebancane sifuna ukuthi singakhula siyegoli.Ngathi ngimbuza ukuthi uyakwazi na ukuthi yindaba abantu bengazizwa ubuzimba njalo bebona ama opportunities ekhona khonale egoli?Wehluleka ukungiphendula.Lina liyibona njani imbono kamasalad lowu.


Indaba yePUMA ngokubona kwami is a right move torwards matabeleland pple taking issues that affect us in the open and the good thing is that abanye bethu abase diaspora siyafuna ukuncedisa on that issue.

I have moved into the depth of the political synagogues and wilderness in Zimbabwe, I am sure that it looks like sooner than latter abantu bakoBulawayo will rise to the occassion and make a difference but before I get into this with depth let talk about PUMA.

I have person reservatiion about the people in PUMA, I kow most of those mentioned above in person! (Which may and may not be a good thing to raise) Firtsly I must say looking at the situation in Zimbabwe, PUMA may infact be something set up to whip the anger of the people of Matabeleland and leave them hopeless and finished in the end. How this can happen can be explained in another article. But The long and short of it is that it could be a pre-emptive strike by the ernemy intelligency. If one knows how pre-emptive strikes work they will understand what I mean. Second, the respectable Nkala is a pusilanimous polititian, if he is one? He infact is a 'prostitute' (this word is used within its contextual meaning not the denigratory common meaning) of chance in political language.

I can almost gaurantee that, unless Nkala has been transformed in the past two years then this is not a joke. But Nkala however enjoys an aray of experience in the contemporary street politics not only of Bulawayo but the whole country. His other major setback is that he is not an activist and has little charisma. He is a man of rules, bieng a former Headmaster and is therefore not innovative!

About PUMA itself the timing is right! But the society is not ready! We need to have a radio station in Matabeleland Broadcasting from outside and prepare opur people. We need to remove them from the fear and hopelessness they have in themselves that the genocide and Nkomo ZAPU left them with. We need a people driven process rather than a leader driven process in Matabeleland. We need the people to believe that the time has come!

Once I again I submit that the main reason why we should not waste our time and resources on PUMA is that no revolution will result from it, in fact it will cost us a few friends and activists.

Bakwethu the effectiveness of this www site is that information is shared and we therefore strnghten each other and thus how critical information sharing is. Thus a radio station targeting Matabeleland will be the key.

I shall not rest until we have built our capacity to shape the minds of our people, to re-educate them on who they are. To make understand once omre that they are a people and have a right to be themselves.

I will better die knowing who I am than live on my knees, believing who they say I am!

Malimaza Sikhulu,

I have not enough time to discuss this issue today but i must tell you that I am thrilled by your willingness to get into some action this soon. I know tha abantu abka-diaspora can make a big difference. But I can alsop comfirm that before we do so the Shona will have made a bigger difference, not because they work hard but because they do the right things. I am only trying to bring to the debate arround setting up a Sort Wave Broadcast to Matabeleland.

This should carry on our discussions at this forum and in other forums! The bondage of subhuman status of our people will not allow them to make change until that bondage is removed. And the only way to remove it is to reinform our people about being Matabele and that it is not wrong to be such.

So a Political party before conscioussness is a baby game! A political party tapes into the people's understanidng of issues, not the other way. That is why although the people of Matabeleland were presented with ZAPU 2000 they voted overwhelmingly against Mugabe but for another party run by a Shona person, instead of a small but home grown party which I am sure if it had managed to send one person to parliament, then the structure and content of the debate in Zim Parliament would have been different by today.

The general Matabele people fear voting a Matabele who says he is Ndebele. They would now vote for anyone else against Mugabe as long as that person does not have a clear Ndebele bais. Yet they must associate with their Tom and Jerry, Keth and Kin but no, they view this as wrong and unacceptable. Its a thin line that we need to remove through information and our people will rise again.

Please consider my thoughts. I have not organised my thoughts properly now and written them properly but I hope you can make sense of the gist of this writing.

this is what an average shona thinks about us(this was a response by a shona to the PUMA article):

Authored by: Anonymous on Thursday, February 16 2006 @ 10:12 PM GMT

Why do you have to believe all this nonsense that you read, there are good sources of information and the rubbish sources of information. You are quite intelligent to distinguish the two. Mandevere havana mari hama yangu, even Lovemore majaivava your fellow Ndebele bretheren said he could not live and perform in Bulawayo because hamuna mari. Can you compare any other part in Mashonaland with Kezi, Tsholotsho, Ngungubane, Lupane. My friend you have to see the situation on the ground not all this nonsense. Some idiot was saying Shona steal in banks and the like, isn't his bread jammed and buttered. What of the the Ndebele thugs in south africa who Rob and terrorise fellow black people. Its time for you to wake up and you have to bear with us the Shonas that we would always be a step ahead whether you like it or not. Open your eyes guys, you are secondary citizens of the land. First Chimurenga, Second Chimurenga, Gukurahundi yokutanga, yechipiri is imminent. As I have said before Bring it on. There are a lot of arms dealers in the world, bring it on anyday anytime and Parence Shiri would still be waiting along with all the Zanu Pf thieves and thugs.
As for the fellow who said, we can't even speak Ndebele,shame on you, why shold we. With my Shona I am still sh***ing Ndebele girls for mahara and they are cheap.

Tendesai

Gay'gusu
I concur with most of your PUMA analysis, your analysis is a breadth of fresh air. As you said that there is a possibility of a pre-empitive strike in play, i do agree with you, but my concern is that maybe we are becoming too much of analysists than activists, we are quick to see doom in every initiative by Mthwakazians, why do not we encourage each other to closely watch for the developments or actually encourage ourselves hijack the idea if possible or influence it to an extent.
We would not be genuine if let one idea hold the struggle back, none theless i fully i agree with your idea of a radio station broadcasting into Mthwakazi from abroad, but this can be used to reinforce what others have already started. It is not true that the people of Mthwakazi are completely empty and devoid of what they are and what they want. A level of consciousness exists in Mthwakazi we do not need to create it from the scratch but to rekindle the fire. If you are prepared and serious about your proposition of a radio station contact me in private and let us take it from there.

just picked it up for ur info.

Harare - President Robert Mugabe has urged Britain's new envoy in Harare to report "true facts" about Zimbabwe to help rebuild relations between the Southern African nation and its former colonial ruler, state media reported on Friday.

But analysts cautioned against optimism that Mugabe's gesture, and his government's clearing of debt arrears to avert possible expulsion from the International Monetary Fund, signalled a readiness to ease its strained ties with the international community.

Relations between Mugabe's government and that of British Prime Minister Tony Blair have been frosty in the last six years due largely to charges from the West that Harare has violated human rights and rigged polls since 2000.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Mugabe denies the charges and says London has championed a propaganda campaign against his administration mainly over its forcible redistribution of white-owned farms to blacks.

Violation of human rights
"President Mugabe has openly told incoming British ambassador to Zimbabwe Dr Andrew Pocock to report true facts about the situation in the country to his government to help build bridges between the two nations," the official Herald newspaper said.

"If you report as your government wants, why send you here? We want you here to help construct formidable bridges. We need a bridge with the British. We politicians come and go, but the people are there at all times," the paper reported Mugabe as telling Pocock.

The Herald story came a day after Mugabe's government announced it had made a $9-million (about R55-million) payment to clear its long-standing arrears on the IMF's General Resources Account, which had raised the possibility of Zimbabwe's expulsion.

But analysts warned it was premature to suggest Harare was actively working to shed its pariah status.

"What Mugabe is saying is nothing new and is insincere. He has made similar statements before and not stuck to them and it is also very clear that he still believes he has never been wrong," said James Jowa, an independent economic and political commentator.

'Help build bridges'
"Even the IMF payment is nothing much to cheer about because nothing on the ground has changed, the government's policies are still lopsided and the economy is still in trouble," Jowa added.

Mugabe, 82 next week and in power since independence in 1980, denies that he has mismanaged and ruined the country's once-thriving economy.

The veteran leader says Western sanctions aimed at Zimbabwe's ruling elite have hit everyone, leading to chronic shortages of foreign currency, fuel, spiralling unemployment and the world's highest rate of inflation at 613 percent.

"You are not punishing Zimbabwe, but you are also punishing your own people, your own economy," the Herald quoted Mugabe as saying to Pocock, alluding to the scores of British-owned companies that still operate in Zimbabwe.

Critics say disruptions to commercial agriculture linked to Mugabe's land reform programme have compounded the problem of drought, leaving what was once southern Africa's food basket in need of food imports in the last six years.

Quite an interesting analysis from Gay'gusu. Who knows? Asiyekeleni ivule umqhekezo ke iPUMA with their supposed pre-emptive strike and re-kindle the consciousness of the Ndebeles.Izavela nxa ithunywa yi ZPF iPUMA ngoba bazakuba lemvumo to organise and assemble people in a mannner not possible in the most recent past among other obvious assessments of course. Labantu bazasola. I can not put a pre-emptive strike past ZPF either!!

Mthwakazi state is far from convincing me as a reality but a dream bantu bakithi...

If i might not be dreaming..,ngicela abekhona ozangilaya, njalo angitshele ukuthi kuyini uMthwakazi azakwenza ukuze lathi amaNdebele kumbe uzulu weMatabeleland asuke esitshoneni lesi...

Ngizathaba bakithi...

Mzala

Gaygusu mfowethu uyihlaziye kamnandi indaba yakho ngakho zihlobo asisondeleni eduze siyitshuke sibanengi sivule amehlo sibuye silalelisise.

MTHWAKAZI OMUHLE NGICELA SINANZELELE NJALO SINGAPHAMBULWA NGABANTU ABAFUNA SIKHULUME NGODABA OLULODWA KUSUKELA KUZIBANDLELA SIZE SIYEFIKA KUMPALAKAZI.INENGI LITHATHA UKUHLUPHEKA LIKWENZE INHLEKISA.

Liyibona njani indaba ye MDC the prosenate faction who have decided to ask another shona to be their leader?Yindaba thina sithanda ukufaka abetshabi ezikundleni zokuba ngabathungameli bethu?Is that we like to be led or we r used to being led?Is it possible for us to change this mentality?

http://www.newzimbabwe.com/pages/senate136.13779.html

Mina ngithi Mthwakazi for life ngikhala ngomcele.

So much for the Mthwakazi element of this mdece having woken up and smelt the coffee? The difference between the pro-senate faction and that dimwit Thoko is the same!

As I have always asserted, this mdece is a non-event in my life and so is anything nor trick they get up to.

Mpthu!

Seeing that the subject of this discussion is headed "Tribal politics --- "I would like to exhaust this topic and then see how we can defend ourselves from who say we are tribalist. I will say a little in response to the question as to why the Mthwakazian MDC has chosen to have Arthur as its leader!

Firstly, I will address the questions as what a tribalist is or what tribalism is. Tribalism is not allowing people who want to different from you to be different. I will give an illustration! If I say Ndebele people will never rule Zimbabwe, many people will blend me a hopeless tribalist, both from the Shona and Ndebele sides. The question is why and what do they mean. They look at how things are and they can tell for sure and that is why Arthur has been brought in.

I will finish this now I have to call my mother have a message she is in hospital

Ngilusizi ngomama ongezwa kahle, sengathi angasila. Angasila phela ungalibali ukuqedisa ingcazelo le okade usasiphakulela yona!

lakanye waze wabheda lumfana.kutsho mina omunye wezinduna zabesuthu, mina uPUDI PEDI[mbuzimbili]. it seems to me that you do not understand what UMTHWAKAZI is. i suggest that you should do your research on a subject before ungakakhulumi wejaha. as said before me 'we shall succeed with or without you'

ps;since your last post in 2006, i would assume that you have changed your mind.if not, then ulahlekile mfana wekhaya!
phendula sikuzwe gwalandini

Hunger knows no gender!
Hunger knows no tribe!
Poverty too is indiscriminate!
Tribalism creates victims and loosers (no winners) - the lamentations of those that have dorned the cloak of victimhood are forever on displayed on this site

Africa is in the quagmire that it finds itself in as a direct consequence on tribalism be it in politics and many other walks of life.

It is either this question is posed in jest or some form of misguided mischief making or indeed both. In either case the answer is resounding nO with a capital "O".

UNITED WE STAND!

Spoken like a cretin.

indeed matebeleland will be an independent state one day. kungani kukhanya angathi we are too ashamed to be who we are; that is ndebele! i for one am not.

hunger knows no yari yari yari.....blah blah blah

i will tell you what, it is no crime to want to be the master of my own destiny. that way i can take myself and my own people seriously, unlike some people we know, who threw our fathers into bottomless pits for no sensible reason.

and yes, if i make my own self go hungry, then i have no one esle to blame, have i?

get that????????????????

mthwakazi omuhle, mina Zulu boy sengiphendukile. Ngilusizi sengitshintshe igama ngaba ngu Maphisa72 becoz of log in problems. Thanks 4 all the insults received but am afraid am still waiting for a constructive posting in response to the 'controversial' topic. Pliz I need a responce from someone who will give me a detailed agenda ka Mthwakazi if any! pliz ncedani bakwethu!

Spoken like a cretin, whatever that means, but you sound like a cretin.

from zulu boy to maphisa72,73,74.....79 whatever

madlenya lo mbuzimbili, why do u waste space writing useless and frivolous material enkundleni? w***ers!! If u got nothing to say, keep your smelly mouth shut and continue............w****ng, of course!

Comrade Potshoza - comrade because that is the moniker that you used to moonlight under. Also interesting to nore is how like Robber Mugabe you have dropped this comrade nonsense. But as they say a leopard never changes its spots and you sir, are the epitomy of that. You must be congratulated and admired that after all these years yours remains a concrete like mind - all mixed up and permanently set!!
The truth of the matter is that tribal politics is not the answer to the Zim crisis - the fact that we have had 27 or so years of it proves that it is a cul de sac to the land of no return. I repeat, for the benefit of the myopic, ignorant and downright dull ( I guess that means you Potshoza), that what is required is blue skies thinking and tredding the path of tribal politics is old and will not lead to peace and prosperity.

I Montenegro, with just over half a million people is a fully independent state. Thina, on a conservative estimate we should be about four million people.There is absolutely no reason why we cannot be fully independent.Okwe MDC lokhu yingcekeza kuphela.Asitshiyane lakho.We need to put our case to the United Nations and make our argument that we are different people from abetshabi.Nxa abanye abanntu besenelisa ukukwenza lokhu thina kungasehlula njani?

Jazi, what you have posted is what I call Idealism. I and many others also subscribe to this idealism but unfortunately realities on the ground and in real life tell a different story. You want unity, thats the ideal, but have you ever asked yourself the following?

1. The 1979 Grand Plan. This document did not just drop from the skies. Somebody must own up and accept responsibility for authoring it. Who wrote it? why is it that what is detailed in the document is what has happened in the last 27 years and is still happening on the ground in Mthwakazi, if at all its a false document?

2. Why do most Shona, many whom you want to unite with are defensive about the document and yet they claim to be anti-Zanu PF and anti-Mugabe. This is supposed to be a Zanu PF document and not necessarily a Shona document, so if one is not a Zanu PF supporter why defend it? If one is an MDC supporter, why defend a document authored by those in Zanu PF or be defensive about it?

3. Why is there so much intolerance among many Shona people whenever we Ndebele people speak our language and yet we allow them to use their language at will without complaining? Many of our people now struggle to speak their nown languages because of their Shona being forced down everyone's throat on the basis of the "majority"?

4. Why is it that many Shona, even in the opposition still tacitly approve of the Gukurawundi in the name of revenging the Mzilikazi era tribal clashes when it suits their agenda, and at times contradict themselves in saying it was meant to put down a military insurrection in M'tland against a legitimate and democratic government, but will conveniently use Gukura again when it suits them to attack Mugabe because he has now also turned against them, in order to gain Mthwakazi support?

5. It seems to me Mugabe is ONLY bad now because he also attacks the Shona and has made them suffer as well; but as long as he attacks, starves, and kills the Ndebele ONLY he is fine? what do you say about this?

6. What about the issue that a person of Mthwakazi origins will never be a President of Zimbabwe, is that not tribalism? Why are Mthwakazi people always expected to deputise Shona people, if at all appointments and elections are based on merit? The Shona argue that the Shona take up leadership positions because they are in the majority, but Merit is not synonymous with mojority. This is why Daniel Arap Moi was a President of Kenya despite him coming from one of the smallest tribes in Kenya, the Kalenjini, and Thabo Mbeki is the President in South Africa, but he hails from a smaller tribe the Xhosa as opposed to the majority tribe the Zulu who are about 10 million, far more than three quarters of Zimbabwe's overall population.

7. What about the constant argument that we should go back to South Africa as if to say they the Shona were created by God to be settled in that country and never re-located from elsewhere, is that not tribalism, is that UNITY?

8. The Shona are the only people I know of in Southern Africa, who have a problem with people whose roots are South African and I dion't know why, maybe you can enlighten me. I have lived in many countries that border South Africa and I can assure you that the Shona are the only excpetion. In Southern Mozambique there are Zulu and Shangani speaking people, languages also spoken in South Africa but this is not an issue, in Mpumalanga province South Africa, isiSwati is spoken, a language spoken in Swaziland but that is not an issue, in the Free State Province we have the Basotho, people also found in Lesotho and that is not an issue. In the North West Province of South Africa they speak Setswana, a language spoken in Botswana and still thats no problem. In Namibia, there are Afrikanners and Afrikaans speaking people but nobody says they are foreigners and should go back to South Africa. Then what is wrong with the Shona in Zimbabwe? They don't want the Shangani, the Basotho,the Nguni, the baVenda, etc because they are said to be South African. And what about people of Malawi origins, they call them names, maBrandaya, and yet many of the Shona have some Malawi and or East African heritage? so much for unity mfowethu!

9. And what about this issue of them living in Mthwakazi for 10, 15, 20 years and still claim not to understand or to speak siNdebele or any other langauge for that matter. Many of them are even married in Mthwakazi but still will not learn the languages? They discourage their Ndebele wives from speaking Ndebele in their homes or teaching the children the language and yet for many Ndebele I know married to Shona women, these women speak Shona at will and even teach the children with no problem?

10. Even were friendships are concerned,I have always found that it is difficult, if not impossible to befriend a Mushona or relate to a Shona without speaking his language. Why is that? For many of us with Shona friends you will admit that the language of communication between us is almost always Shona, why? If one insists on his identity, his own language etc as they do here in South Africa,I can assure you they would not be any relationship; Only in very, very few and exceptional cases!

Yikho ke Jazi mfowethu leUNITY okhuluma ngayo, yi UNITY on whose terms? It seems to me we can only unite if we follow the Zanu/Zapu type of unity, were we always have to play second fiddle. As you can see, this is why the Ndebele always deputise the Shona. And for many of our people (and it pains me a lot) this has become second nature as we now almost have accepted it as normal. Can you imagine some years past I was in Gweru one time and I spoke to a petrol attendant in SiNdebele asking him to put petrol in my vehicle and some of my fellow Ndebele I was with were purtebed that I was speaking to him in Ndebele; as if it has become taboo to speak to a Shona in SiNdebele! Our people have internalised this problem , developed inferiority complexes and totally forgot that their languages and cultures are constitutionally protected in that country and should be used anywhere anytime, even in Harare as much as Shona is!

Put your foot down, you don't have to speak to a Shona in Shona. It is not a crime to speak your language! SO MUCH FOR THIS SO-CALLED UNITY MFOWETHU!

Spade Onmyama

ungazabe usaya le e-Montenegro khatshana,

"Eritrea [which has roughly the same population ekaMthwakazi] was awarded to Ethiopia in 1952 as part of a federation. Ethiopia's annexation of Eritrea as a province 10 years later sparked a 30-year struggle for independence that ended in 1991 with Eritrean rebels defeating governmental forces; independence was overwhelmingly approved in a 1993 referendum." -extracted from http://www.nationmaster.com/country/er-eritrea

one other interesting fact (unverified) is that 2/3 of all Eritreans are in the diaspora, or at least 3/4 of its economy is supported by money from the diaspora.

lokhu kuyafana lento esikhuluma ngayo lapha. our cowards like the ones we have here will follow us everywhere. but the fact is akekho umuntu ozakuwa emkhathini ezosikhulula. recent history is flowered with evidence of successful rebellion against unjust and tyrannical regimes, (illegitimate as well, one might add). we only have to remind ourselves of the Indonesian revolution (1998), the Orange revolution (2004-2005), etc. laba ngabantu abazinikelayo ukuba ngama-masters of their own destiny. and yes, they are free today, including Eritreans, Jazi

Vunguza,

Wayitshaya ekhanda, wethu!Spoken like a true son of Mthwakazi!Abetshabi asitshiyane labo.That is our only salvation.